<div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr">On Tue, Dec 15, 2020 at 6:49 PM Japheth Cleaver <<a href="mailto:cleaver@terabithia.org">cleaver@terabithia.org</a>> wrote:<br></div><div class="gmail_quote"><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
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<div>On 12/15/2020 6:18 PM, Brendan Conoboy
wrote:<br>
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<blockquote type="cite">
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<div dir="ltr">On Tue, Dec 15, 2020 at 5:42 PM Mauricio Tavares
<<a href="mailto:raubvogel@gmail.com" target="_blank">raubvogel@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<br>
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<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">On Tue, Dec 15, 2020 at
6:30 PM Jason Brooks <<a href="mailto:jbrooks@redhat.com" target="_blank">jbrooks@redhat.com</a>>
wrote:<br>
><br>
[...]<br>
> No. I was on that team too, and growing CentOS beyond
just consumption<br>
> and into contribution was something we emphasized
throughout. Our<br>
> primary intent, the reason the whole thing got started,
was that we<br>
> needed to provide our layered projects with a
slow-moving community<br>
> distro to layer atop. That's why we put so much effort
into the SIGs,<br>
> and into opening up the build processes and tools. Even
with that work<br>
> done, until we opened up RHEL development itself,
contributions to the<br>
> core of CentOS were basically blocked. Now, in addition
to the layered<br>
> project need, which hasn't gone away, we need a distro
to open up RHEL<br>
> development, and CentOS Stream is that distro.<br>
><br>
Isn't that what fedora is used for?</blockquote>
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<div>Fedora is used as a starting point for major release
alphas and betas, i.e., 7.0 Beta, 8.0 Beta, etc. After the
major release beta comes out all automatic connection
between Fedora and RHEL ceases. RHEL 8.2 was based on 8.1 +
upstream changes, 8.1 was based on 8.0 plus upstream
changes. There simply hasn't been a place where people
outside the Red Hat firewall can see, use, and influence the
direction of the next minor release, as it is being
created. That's what Stream is meant to do.</div></div>
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<p>Minor release updates very rarely have a need for significant
influence, but I'm unsure how this is supposed to relate to actual
RHEL minor version Beta releases. </p></div></blockquote><div>That's a very interesting and unexpected standpoint. Do you only use the features present in the .0 release?</div><div></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><div><p>Will there still even be RHEL
8.x Beta Releases?<br></p></div></blockquote><div> We have one planned for 8.4. In the future, who knows?</div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><div><p>
</p>
<p>But beyond that, the above statement does not seem to be
compatible with the following:</p>
<div>On 12/15/2020 3:35 PM, Johnny Hughes
wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite"><pre>You guys keep calling it beta .. it is not.
The RHEL team is not grabbing brand new software (like the do in
Rawhide, for example) and trying to roll that into RHEL. They are going
to do one of three type of updates.
1) A security update
2) A bugfix update.
3) An Enhancement update.
For #1 and #2 .. you want those rolled in and you want them rolled in
ASAP. RHEAs do not make up that many of the updates. You are getting
these after QA testing a couple months early at most.
</pre>
</blockquote>
<p>There's no meaningful "influence" at this point beyond filing BZs
about things that break. While that's certainly better than
nothing, if RedHat wanted to accept bugs from non-RHEL binaries,
especially in-house rebuilds explicitly targeting 100% binary
compatibility, it could easily have done so at any point in the
past.</p>
<p>There's still a conflation of upstream and downstream here. The
"direction" of any aspect of RHEL is already going to be quite set
by the time it gets into CentOS Stream... as is appropriate for a
downstream.</p></div></blockquote><div>I think you've succinctly expressed that we have not done a good enough job of painting and sustaining a picture of the potential breadth of CentOS Stream and what it could mean to add additional facets to the community's self identity.</div></div><div><br></div>-- <br><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_signature">Brendan Conoboy / Linux Project Lead / Red Hat, Inc.</div></div>