On Thu, October 30, 2014 3:01 am, Cliff Pratt wrote: > That's exactly what I mean. It's not a matter of "starting into the > Windows > world". My point was that Windows admins have not become obsessed with > "uptime", and hence given their users the expectation of 100% > availability. > > I'm all for being responsible to users - and that means patching and if > that means some downtime, If I remember Unix world, patching almost never led to downtime and almost always could be accomplished in presence of users logged in. Valeri then the users in general would not be put out, > if their expectations had not been raised to expect no downtime. > > Cheers, > > Cliff > > On Thu, Oct 30, 2014 at 12:40 PM, Valeri Galtsev > <galtsev at kicp.uchicago.edu> > wrote: > >> >> On Wed, October 29, 2014 6:32 pm, Cliff Pratt wrote: >> > On Thu, Oct 30, 2014 at 10:12 AM, Valeri Galtsev >> > <galtsev at kicp.uchicago.edu> >> > wrote: >> > >> >> >> >> On Wed, October 29, 2014 4:02 pm, Beartooth wrote: >> >> > On Wed, 29 Oct 2014 11:44:42 -0500, Valeri Galtsev wrote: >> >> > >> >> >> ... Basically, if one thinks he knows >> >> >> more than system vendor, he is just schizophrenic. And we, normal >> >> >> people, do give schizophrenics a privilege to be on their own. As >> we, >> >> >> normal people know that if the distro maintainers had to update >> >> kernel, >> >> >> they had a reason (otherwise, something else breaks). So, we are >> left >> >> >> running _this_ system, even though it's stressful, still not as >> >> >> stressful as running "bleeding edge" fedora, right? ;-) >> >> > >> >> > What? Stressful?? Fedora??? Naaahhh ... >> >> >> >> I'm sorry, apart from my laptop, I also run servers. And services are >> >> supposed to be up 24/7. And a bunch of people are always logged in... >> >> You >> >> do the math. >> >> >> >> This is a corner that system administrators have allowed themselves >> to >> >> be >> > painted into. It's not a law of nature. Civilized organisations will >> > always >> > allow a maintenance Window. In the Windows world it is not an issue. >> > Servers can be rebooted with much more freedom than in the Linux/Unix >> > world. >> > >> >> Yes, indeed. Those are blasted Unix sysadmins (Hm, I flatter myself by >> thinking of being one too) that push themselves into being too >> responsible >> to their users... No, I don't think Unix admins will start into the >> direction of Windows world, sorry. I don't even like Windows world >> mentioned as an example for Unix world! (Don't take me too literally, >> everybody welcomes good things "other worlds" have...) >> >> Valeri >> >> ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ >> Valeri Galtsev >> Sr System Administrator >> Department of Astronomy and Astrophysics >> Kavli Institute for Cosmological Physics >> University of Chicago >> Phone: 773-702-4247 >> ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ >> _______________________________________________ >> CentOS mailing list >> CentOS at centos.org >> http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos >> > _______________________________________________ > CentOS mailing list > CentOS at centos.org > http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos > ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Valeri Galtsev Sr System Administrator Department of Astronomy and Astrophysics Kavli Institute for Cosmological Physics University of Chicago Phone: 773-702-4247 ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++