On 17/05/2021 20:46, Phil Perry wrote:
> On 17/05/2021 20:30, Johnny Hughes wrote:
>> On 5/17/21 1:46 PM, Mike McGrath wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>> On Mon, May 17, 2021 at 1:34 PM Phil Perry <pperry@elrepo.org
>>> <mailto:pperry@elrepo.org>> wrote:
>>>
>>> On 17/05/2021 18:49, Troy Dawson wrote:
>>> >
>>> >
>>> > On Mon, May 17, 2021 at 10:41 AM Phil Perry <pperry@elrepo.org
>>> <mailto:pperry@elrepo.org>
>>> > <mailto:pperry@elrepo.org <mailto:pperry@elrepo.org>>> wrote:
>>> >
>>> > On 17/05/2021 14:32, Troy Dawson wrote:
>>> > >
>>> > >
>>> > > On Mon, May 17, 2021 at 6:22 AM Fabian Arrotin
>>> <arrfab@centos.org <mailto:arrfab@centos.org>
>>> > <mailto:arrfab@centos.org <mailto:arrfab@centos.org>>
>>> > > <mailto:arrfab@centos.org <mailto:arrfab@centos.org>
>>> <mailto:arrfab@centos.org <mailto:arrfab@centos.org>>>> wrote:
>>> > >
>>> > > On 17/05/2021 15:10, Troy Dawson wrote:
>>> > > >
>>> > > >
>>> > > > On Sat, May 15, 2021 at 6:47 AM Leon Fauster via
>>> CentOS-devel
>>> > > > <centos-devel@centos.org
>>> <mailto:centos-devel@centos.org> <mailto:centos-devel@centos.org
>>> <mailto:centos-devel@centos.org>>
>>> > <mailto:centos-devel@centos.org
>>> <mailto:centos-devel@centos.org> <mailto:centos-devel@centos.org
>>> <mailto:centos-devel@centos.org>>>
>>> > > <mailto:centos-devel@centos.org
>>> <mailto:centos-devel@centos.org>
>>> > <mailto:centos-devel@centos.org
>>> <mailto:centos-devel@centos.org>> <mailto:centos-devel@centos.org
>>> <mailto:centos-devel@centos.org>
>>> > <mailto:centos-devel@centos.org
>>> <mailto:centos-devel@centos.org>>>>>
>>> > > wrote:
>>> > > >
>>> > > > On 15.05.21 06:51, Troy Dawson wrote:
>>> > > > > Back when the CentOS 8 Devel repo[1] was
>>> originally
>>> > > introduced, the
>>> > > > > CentOS Stream 8 Devel repo[2] was kept empty.
>>> > > > > Now that CentOS 8 is going away, and we are
>>> expected to
>>> > > develop on
>>> > > > > CentOS Stream 8, could we please get CentOS
>>> Stream 8
>>> > Devel
>>> > > populated
>>> > > > > with the same packages it once had.
>>> > > > >
>>> > > > > I know there is an initiative for all the
>>> missing -devel
>>> > > packages to
>>> > > > > appear somewhere at sometime. But here is my
>>> problem.
>>> > > > > I'm trying to get KDE rebuilt for CentOS
>>> Stream 8
>>> > due to the
>>> > > > updated qt5
>>> > > > > that is now in Stream.
>>> > > > > plasma-nm, a fairly important piece of KDE,
>>> requires
>>> > > > > mobile-broadband-provider-info-devel which is
>>> in the
>>> > Devel
>>> > > repo.
>>> > > > > From what I see, the fastest way to get
>>> > > > > mobile-broadband-provider-info-devel
>>> somewhere
>>> that
>>> > I can
>>> > > consume
>>> > > > it on
>>> > > > > Stream is via the Devel repo.
>>> > > > > Thus my question.
>>> > > > >
>>> > > > > Can we get CentOS Stream 8 Devel populated
>>> with
>>> > whatever is
>>> > > in the
>>> > > > > regular Devel repo.
>>> > > > >
>>> > > > > Thanks
>>> > > > > Troy Dawson
>>> > > > >
>>> > > > > [1] -
>>> > >
>>> http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/
>>> <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/>
>>> > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/
>>> <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/>>
>>> > >
>>> <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/
>>> <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/>
>>> > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/
>>> <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/>>>
>>> > > >
>>> >
>>> <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/
>>> <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/>
>>> > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/
>>> <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/>>
>>> > >
>>> <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/
>>> <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/>
>>> > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/
>>> <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/>>>>
>>> > > > >
>>> > >
>>> <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/
>>> <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/>
>>> > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/
>>> <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/>>
>>> > >
>>> <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/
>>> <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/>
>>> > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/
>>> <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/>>>
>>> > > >
>>> >
>>> <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/
>>> <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/>
>>> > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/
>>> <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/>>
>>> > >
>>> <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/
>>> <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/>
>>> > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/
>>> <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/>>>>>
>>> > > > > [2] -
>>> > > >
>>> > >
>>> >
>>> http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/
>>>
>>> <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/>
>>> >
>>>
>>> <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/
>>>
>>> <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/>>
>>> > >
>>> >
>>>
>>> <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/
>>>
>>> <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/>
>>> <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/
>>>
>>> <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/>>>
>>> > > >
>>> > >
>>> >
>>>
>>> <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/
>>>
>>> <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/>
>>> <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/
>>>
>>> <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/>>
>>> <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/
>>>
>>> <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/>
>>> <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/
>>>
>>> <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/>>>>
>>> > > > >
>>> > > >
>>> > >
>>> >
>>>
>>> <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/
>>>
>>> <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/>
>>> <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/
>>>
>>> <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/>>
>>> <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/
>>>
>>> <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/>
>>> <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/
>>>
>>> <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/>>>
>>> > > >
>>> > >
>>> >
>>>
>>> <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/
>>>
>>> <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/>
>>> <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/
>>>
>>> <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/>>
>>> <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/
>>>
>>> <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/>
>>> <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/
>>>
>>> <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/>>>>>
>>> > > > >
>>> > > >
>>> > > > JFI:
>>> > > >
>>> > > > Downloads from koji instance allowed now.
>>> > > > https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/
>>> <https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/>
>>> > <https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/
>>> <https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/>>
>>> > > <https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/
>>> <https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/>
>>> > <https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/
>>> <https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/>>>
>>> > > > <https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/
>>> <https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/>
>>> > <https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/
>>> <https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/>>
>>> > > <https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/
>>> <https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/>
>>> > <https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/
>>> <https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/>>>>
>>> > > >
>>> > > >
>>> > > > True, but that doesn't get them into the EPEL or
>>> COPR build
>>> > > environment.
>>> > > >
>>> > > > Troy
>>> > > >
>>> > >
>>> > > Hi Troy,
>>> > >
>>> > > As you're now part of the CentOS Stream team, when
>>> can we
>>> > expect to see
>>> > > that Devel repo being populated ? that would help
>>> for now
>>> > SIGs building
>>> > > in cbs.centos.org <http://cbs.centos.org>
>>> <http://cbs.centos.org <http://cbs.centos.org>>
>>> > <http://cbs.centos.org <http://cbs.centos.org>
>>> <http://cbs.centos.org <http://cbs.centos.org>>> (and we have
>>> also again
>>> > > other requests for built but
>>> > > unreleased pkgs in Devel repo, so having a status
>>> update on
>>> > that one
>>> > > would be good too)
>>> > >
>>> > >
>>> > > Well played good sir.
>>> > > Unfortunately I only deal with the CentOS Stream 9 stuff,
>>> but I will
>>> > > bring it up in the team meeting.
>>> > >
>>> > > I wrote this email on the centos-devel mailing list, as
>>> an EPEL
>>> > package
>>> > > maintainer, that has a problem. Because my EPEL work is
>>> done in my
>>> > > spare time, and it's a legitimate EPEL packager problem.
>>> And I'd
>>> > like
>>> > > the solution to be public, and not behind closed doors.
>>> > >
>>> > > Troy
>>> > >
>>> >
>>> > I'm not sure I understand why this is even an issue anymore.
>>> Now CentOS
>>> > Stream is upstream of RHEL, surely there are no
>>> constraints to
>>> only
>>> > ship
>>> > what RHEL (downstream) ships? Why wouldn't CentOS Stream
>>> simply ship
>>> > everything and if RHEL decides upon a policy to only
>>> ship/support a
>>> > certain subset of (-devel) packages, that is a RH/RHEL
>>> decision that
>>> > can
>>> > be implemented downstream by removing the bits they don't
>>> want to
>>> > ship/support and should have zero impact upstream? RH/RHEL
>>> are
>>> free to
>>> > do whatever they want downstream.
>>> >
>>> > Or have I completely misunderstood the relationship here?
>>> >
>>>
>>> Hi Troy,
>>>
>>> >
>>> > Actually, you understood it correctly.
>>> >
>>> > It seems an email got misplaced. When it was announced that
>>> CentOS
>>> > Stream 9 koji build system, including the buildroot, was now
>>> publically
>>> > available, there was also supposed to be a similar announcement
>>> > concerning CentOS Stream 8. For some reason, that announcement
>>> failed
>>> > to get sent.
>>> >
>>> > So, you are correct, there currently is a way for the EPEL
>>> community (or
>>> > COPR, or whoever wants) to get access to the CentOS Stream 8
>>> build
>>> > system and complete buildroot. I simply was not aware of it.
>>> >
>>>
>>> Except, as you stated earlier in the thread, they are not in the
>>> CentOS
>>> Stream repos, so it is still not possible to easily pull them into
>>> build
>>> environments.
>>>
>>> I believe your question is valid. Why are these packages being
>>> excluded
>>> from CenOS Stream in the first place? I understand why they are
>>> excluded
>>> from CentOS Linux 8, as that is a like for like rebuild of RHEL
>>> 8, and
>>> what is not in RHEL will not be in CentOS Linux. But CentOS
>>> Stream is
>>> upstream of RHEL, not downstream, so I do not understand why ANY
>>> built
>>> devel packages are excluded from the CentOS Stream repos. Why
>>> would you
>>> not ship everything you build??? RHEL policy decisions should not
>>> affect
>>> what happens upstream.
>>>
>>>
>>> This is mostly because we also don't ship it in RHEL and we don't ship
>>> it there because we don't want to be on the hook to support it (even
>>> RHEL has a budget and limited resources).
>>>
>>> As far as CentOS Stream, the promise is that if it runs in CentOS Stream
>>> today it should run in the next version of RHEL. By including content
>>> in Stream that we don't include in RHEL, suddenly that promise is broken
>>> if someone accidentally uses it assuming it's in RHEL.
>>>
>>> I'm not saying there aren't ways to work through these issues, but I
>>> wanted to give some ideas as to the thought process that got us here.
>>>
>>> -Mike
>>>
>>
>> Mike,
>>
>> That is all well and good .. but it is your guys (EPEL and Red Hat SIGs)
>> that need this Development content to be in CentOS Stream and the CentOS
>> Community Build System to build things. (I can build things as this
>> content is already in my Koji buildroot).
>>
>> And it is me, this list, and the CentOS Stream group that keep getting
>> asked (by EPEL and the RH SIGs) why this open source stuff can not be in
>> CentOS Linux, CentOS Stream and the CBS.
>>
>> Surely we can set up a non RHEL released repo that your guys can use to
>> build the things that they want.
>>
>> Thanks,
>> Johnny Hughes
>
>
> But from what Mike just said, EPEL/SIGs should be building against those
> missing -devel packages on Stream because anything built on Stream must
> also run on RHEL?
>
Sorry, typo - EPEL/SIGs should NOT be building against those missing
-devel packages...
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