[CentOS-devel] CentOS Atomic SIG Meeting Minutes 2015-12-03

Last week the meetbot died during our CentOS Atomic SIG meeting. This is the log from the meeting, and the one action item we set. See you at the meeting tomorrow at 16:00 UTC in #centos-devel.

Jason

Actions:

jbrooks to poke around about upstream cockpit-docker exclusion

2015-12-03T16:02:30  <jbrooks> #startmeeting CentOS Atomic SIG
2015-12-03T16:02:30  <centbot> Meeting started Thu Dec  3 16:02:30 2015 UTC.  The chair is jbrooks. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
2015-12-03T16:02:30  <centbot> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic.
2015-12-03T16:02:31  <dustymabe> for thanksgiving
2015-12-03T16:02:58  <dustymabe> lalatend1M: meeting time
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2015-12-03T16:03:07  <jbrooks> #chair dustymabe maxamillion kbsingh lalatend1M jzb
2015-12-03T16:03:07  <centbot> Current chairs: dustymabe jbrooks jzb kbsingh lalatend1M maxamillion
2015-12-03T16:03:32  <jbrooks> who else?
2015-12-03T16:03:40  <tmrts> o/
2015-12-03T16:03:53  <jbrooks> #chair tmrts
2015-12-03T16:03:53  <centbot> Current chairs: dustymabe jbrooks jzb kbsingh lalatend1M maxamillion tmrts
2015-12-03T16:04:27  <jbrooks> #topic CentOS Atomic Host Rebuild status
2015-12-03T16:04:49  * lalatend1M i shere
2015-12-03T16:05:01  <jbrooks> We had a rebuild release on Nov 24
2015-12-03T16:05:11  <jbrooks> That was the last of the "7.1" rebuilds
2015-12-03T16:05:33  <jbrooks> Currently, I'm iterating through getting the rebuild based on the new centos pkgs built
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2015-12-03T16:06:09  <jbrooks> I'm using the CR repo and sort of a extras-next temp repo set up by Johnny
2015-12-03T16:06:37  <dustymabe> nice
2015-12-03T16:06:50  <jbrooks> So that's moving along decently
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2015-12-03T16:07:34  <hhorak> RemiFedora: kbsingh: guys here are working on it, but they need to move a lot of data and re-set up new server.
2015-12-03T16:07:54  <jbrooks> That brings up sort of a subtopic -- there's been some interest expressed in adding the cockpit-docker and cockpit-kubernetes pkgs into our rebuild
2015-12-03T16:08:12  <kbsingh> hhorak: time to introduce some automation
2015-12-03T16:08:21  <hhorak> RemiFedora: I'd like to make the official announcements together for el6 and el7, and el6 is still not ready.
2015-12-03T16:08:22  <kbsingh> hhorak: if we can do something to help, do tell
2015-12-03T16:08:40  <jbrooks> RHEL Atomic doesn't include these, so that'd be a divergence, but the pkgs themselves are in the standard centos repos
2015-12-03T16:08:43  <dustymabe> jbrooks: and those packages aren't in RHELAH
2015-12-03T16:08:45  <dustymabe> ?
2015-12-03T16:09:06  <kbsingh> are they shipped as containers ?
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2015-12-03T16:09:14  <jbrooks> dustymabe, Right, not in the host, but are available, as in, not from the CBS or something
2015-12-03T16:09:15  <kbsingh> i.e why are they released if they are not included in the AH
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2015-12-03T16:09:32  <jbrooks> They, like cockpit-bridge and cockpit-shell, control host things
2015-12-03T16:09:46  <hhorak> kbsingh: well, the sclo6 packages are still not signed/released, right? if they were, we can point people to use those, as RemiFedora proposed :)
2015-12-03T16:09:51  <jbrooks> Really, only cockpit-ws, the web app, is containerizable, as I understand it
2015-12-03T16:09:55  <dustymabe> jbrooks: was a decision made to exclude them from RHEL-AH?
2015-12-03T16:10:10  <dustymabe> or would they consider including them as well?
2015-12-03T16:10:22  <jbrooks> dustymabe, I don't know, I assume so, since they're not there. I don't know why
2015-12-03T16:10:42  <kbsingh> hhorak: they were added to the configs last night, but the job didnt run through cleanly.
2015-12-03T16:10:47  <jbrooks> Maybe not fitting the SKU vision or something?
2015-12-03T16:10:49  <kbsingh> hhorak: i will get them out tomorrow
2015-12-03T16:10:55  <dustymabe> might be worth asking - if there is a good enough reason then that might be a good reason we shouldn't do it
2015-12-03T16:11:11  <jbrooks> OK
2015-12-03T16:11:26  <jbrooks> #action jbrooks to poke around about upstream cockpit-docker exclusion
2015-12-03T16:12:13  <jbrooks> Anything else on this topic?
2015-12-03T16:12:36  <hhorak> kbsingh: ok, thx.. I'll at least point people to el7 builds at least :)
2015-12-03T16:12:49  <dustymabe> jbrooks: nope
2015-12-03T16:13:54  <jbrooks> #topic Four Week Build
2015-12-03T16:14:03  <jbrooks> So, I haven't done anything new on this front
2015-12-03T16:14:23  <kbsingh> me neither
2015-12-03T16:14:24  <jbrooks> I do see that the fedora two week has been firming up, and that's important for the four week
2015-12-03T16:14:55  <jbrooks> The trick now is figuring out a semi-automated flow of the fedora two week "atomic" pkgs into the CBS
2015-12-03T16:14:56  <dustymabe> yeah. honestly I wish I had more time to devote to this, but i've been stretched thin
2015-12-03T16:15:33  <jbrooks> OK, I figured I'd bump it up in ppl's minds, at least :)
2015-12-03T16:15:55  <jbrooks> Other topics before open floor? lalatenduM, do you have adb-related issues?
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2015-12-03T16:16:12  <lalatenduM> jbrooks: yeah
2015-12-03T16:16:21  <jbrooks> #topic ADB
2015-12-03T16:16:36  <lalatenduM> is centos 7.2 out?
2015-12-03T16:16:43  <kbsingh> we have an arm build getting ready - and quite a few people have expressed interest in getting atomic host there as well - is that something we might want to take up in the scope of this group ?
2015-12-03T16:16:43  <jbrooks> Not yet
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2015-12-03T16:17:03  <dustymabe> kbsingh: I have thought about that before.. I like the idea
2015-12-03T16:17:10  <kbsingh> not yet, but eta is a week or so from now
2015-12-03T16:17:10  <lalatenduM> kbsingh: yup I think so
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2015-12-03T16:17:14  <jbrooks> kbsingh, sure
2015-12-03T16:17:30  <kbsingh> the ostree patches needed to support uboot already exist...
2015-12-03T16:17:30  <lalatenduM> I am going to do a ADB build once 7.2 is out
2015-12-03T16:17:46  <jbrooks> lalatenduM, cool
2015-12-03T16:17:50  <lalatenduM> but looks like we have to manage with scratch build
2015-12-03T16:17:59  <kbsingh> lalatenduM: at the moment, the CR repos have all the content already seeded up, so if you can use taht - it might give you a base to test / trial waiting for main line release
2015-12-03T16:18:03  <lalatenduM> as there s a SCm error with teh non scratch builds
2015-12-03T16:18:25  <lalatenduM> is a scm error*
2015-12-03T16:18:28  <lalatenduM> kbsingh: yeah
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2015-12-03T16:18:48  <kbsingh> i think we will get the scm side of things figured out in the coming days as well, once the git <-> Accounts.centos.org stuff is in place, the git stuff becomes easy ( and the plan is to get that git stuff integrated in the next 10 days or so)
2015-12-03T16:18:54  <jbrooks> lalatenduM, Is there a bug for that error that we can link here
2015-12-03T16:19:01  <lalatenduM> kbsingh: cool
2015-12-03T16:19:11  <lalatenduM> jbrooks: good idea I will file one.
2015-12-03T16:19:23  <kbsingh> jbrooks: tl'dr, cbs needs scm == git.centos.org; but we have no clear path to hosting non rpm content for sig's yet
2015-12-03T16:19:24  <jbrooks> Anything more on that?
2015-12-03T16:19:25  <lalatenduM> I had sent a mail to centos-devel about it
2015-12-03T16:19:37  <jbrooks> Ah, ok
2015-12-03T16:19:41  <kbsingh> ie. we need to get the auth layer in place, then see how that maps to branch names, sig space etc.
2015-12-03T16:20:16  <lalatenduM> Also planning to build teh openshift origin docker image to include in the adb box, but thats not a blocker
2015-12-03T16:20:46  <jbrooks> https://lists.centos.org/pipermail/centos-devel/2015-November/014034.html
2015-12-03T16:20:47  <lalatenduM> till we have a better caching solution for docker image
2015-12-03T16:20:57  <jbrooks> ^ that's the centos-devel msg, I believe
2015-12-03T16:21:03  <lalatenduM> jbrooks: yup
2015-12-03T16:21:20  <jbrooks> OK, any more on that?
2015-12-03T16:21:28  <lalatenduM> nope I am done
2015-12-03T16:21:38  <jbrooks> #topic Open Floor
2015-12-03T16:21:42  <tmrts> I'd like to talk about replacing cloud-init
2015-12-03T16:21:54  <jbrooks> tmrts, Cool, go ahead
2015-12-03T16:22:05  <tmrts> As you guys know I developed https://github.com/tmrts/flamingo to be a replacement for cloud-init
2015-12-03T16:22:32  <tmrts> We were in the process of integrating it to Atomic Host but I've had some health issues
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2015-12-03T16:23:11  <tmrts> I was away from the SIG for a while and I'd like to complete the process if the intention is still the same
2015-12-03T16:23:50  <jbrooks> tmrts, Have you made any test images w/ flamingo built-in?
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2015-12-03T16:24:25  <tmrts> I tried to rebuild the image with flamingo rpm (both on copr and centos build system) but I've had libvirtd issues Is there any developments on the build system for the images or is it still done through scripts?
2015-12-03T16:24:48  <jbrooks> Still scripts
2015-12-03T16:25:05  <jbrooks> Point me at your copr or cbs location and I can try to do a build
2015-12-03T16:25:19  <tmrts> jbrooks, I performed integration tests with the custom built image but It needs to be done again as I understand there was updates
2015-12-03T16:25:57  <dustymabe> did any of us ever evaluate the coreos rewrite of cloud-init
2015-12-03T16:26:06  <tmrts> in cbs you can find it with atomic-testing label and I'll link the copr in a sec
2015-12-03T16:26:16  <dustymabe> if we could combine efforts then I think we could gain momentum
2015-12-03T16:26:36  <tmrts> I've had discussions with the core-os team
2015-12-03T16:26:47  <kbsingh> the intel guys are also redoing things, again in go. for their clear containers effort
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2015-12-03T16:27:04  <jbrooks> dustymabe, Not me -- it'd be good to hook up w/ the fedora cloud folks and do some sort of info/testing roundup of these options
2015-12-03T16:27:18  <jbrooks> ID the issues w/ cloud-init, the options, etc.
2015-12-03T16:27:24  <tmrts> They want to merge efforts as well. But, for us it would mean jumping on coreos-cloudinit and contributing to it so that we can use it
2015-12-03T16:27:56  <jbrooks> tmrts, does it fit w/ what you've been doing?
2015-12-03T16:28:01  <tmrts> #info copr repository https://copr.fedoraproject.org/coprs/tamertas/flamingo/
2015-12-03T16:28:07  <jbrooks> thx
2015-12-03T16:28:36  <tmrts> jbrooks, do you mean getting in touch with fedora folks?
2015-12-03T16:28:39  <dustymabe> tmrts: nice so you have reached out to them?
2015-12-03T16:28:45  <dustymabe> them == coreos
2015-12-03T16:28:49  <jbrooks> tmrts, the coreos effort
2015-12-03T16:29:01  <jbrooks> Like, does merging efforts make sense to you?
2015-12-03T16:29:12  <tmrts> dustymabe, they've reached out to me
2015-12-03T16:29:19  <dustymabe> oh, even better
2015-12-03T16:29:32  <lalatenduM> cool
2015-12-03T16:30:11  <tmrts> I evaluated coreos-cloudinit and basically they hardwired it to coreos (some parts).  ultimately a joint effort would be better
2015-12-03T16:30:42  <tmrts> But, we'd need to contribute to coreos-cloudinit and make it work for us
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2015-12-03T16:31:13  <dustymabe> tmrts: right. so what I would say is that it's going to be hard to convince them to abandon what they have. what I would propose is that we actually evaluate what they have, remove the hardwired parts, but still allow them to achieve their goals with those hardwirings
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2015-12-03T16:31:32  <dustymabe> and then we can together launch a new project together with them
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2015-12-03T16:31:43  <dustymabe> under some different branding
2015-12-03T16:31:44  <tmrts> dustymabe, absolutely it makes no sense for them to abandon it
2015-12-03T16:32:21  <dustymabe> honestly if we get centos and coreos on-board many others will follow suit
2015-12-03T16:32:24  <dustymabe> IMHO
2015-12-03T16:32:40  <dustymabe> because many people (myself included) view cloud-init from ubuntu as dead
2015-12-03T16:33:17  <dustymabe> thoughts from anyone else on this?
2015-12-03T16:33:24  <jbrooks> Agreed, though we really need to get fedora into the loop -- that's where centos ultimately comes from. For the rebuild, certainly, and we've been envisioning the four-week in that way, as well
2015-12-03T16:34:10  <jbrooks> Do we have a next action on this?
2015-12-03T16:34:12  <dustymabe> jbrooks: agree
2015-12-03T16:34:23  <dustymabe> probably would be better to do it in fedora first
2015-12-03T16:34:48  <dustymabe> tmrts: are you interested in combining efforts with coreos or are you more interested in flamingo as it exists today?
2015-12-03T16:35:09  <dustymabe> you never know. they might even be willing to keep the flamingo name for the launch of the combined effort
2015-12-03T16:35:20  <dustymabe> but most likely would want to have the new project be based largely on their code
2015-12-03T16:35:28  <dustymabe> makes sense since it is already being used and testeed
2015-12-03T16:36:00  <tmrts> dustymabe, Here's my viewpoint a collaboration would be very helpful, but as it stands it would mean splitting flamingo into parts and contribute it to coreos-cloudinit
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2015-12-03T16:36:39  <dustymabe> right
2015-12-03T16:37:02  <dustymabe> which I think probably makes the most sense, because it is already in production and being used
2015-12-03T16:37:25  <kbsingh> i need to rebase away to another thing, thanks fuys
2015-12-03T16:37:26  <kbsingh> guys even
2015-12-03T16:37:28  <dustymabe> if it was the other way around where flamingo was out there and had users and coreos didn't then probably would go the other way
2015-12-03T16:37:47  <dustymabe> tmrts: any chance you will be at fosdem?
2015-12-03T16:38:19  <tmrts> dustymabe, yeah I agree with you it is battle-tested
2015-12-03T16:38:34  <tmrts> dustymabe, unfortunately I won't be able to attend
2015-12-03T16:38:53  <dustymabe> maybe the architecture needs rework (to match your design better), but most of the code will probably come from coreos-cloudinit
2015-12-03T16:38:58  <dustymabe> which is actually probably a good thing for us
2015-12-03T16:39:16  <dustymabe> since they probably support way more functionality at this point (not sure on this, just guessing)
2015-12-03T16:39:55  <dustymabe> tmrts: so I guess what I am asking is "is the proposal I made acceptable to you?"
2015-12-03T16:40:00  <dustymabe> since you wrote flamingo
2015-12-03T16:41:04  <tmrts> dustymabe, the most acceptable choice would be to create a new organization(or effort) and merge what they have with flamingo along with them
2015-12-03T16:41:27  <dustymabe> right. and what I am proposing is that we do that
2015-12-03T16:41:47  <tmrts> dustymabe, yes I agree with you
2015-12-03T16:41:52  <dustymabe> where the new org has probably most of the new code coming from coreos-cloud-init and some of it coming from flamingo
2015-12-03T16:42:24  <dustymabe> either way we want to merge our efforts
2015-12-03T16:42:33  <dustymabe> some of the coreos devs live in NYC
2015-12-03T16:42:39  <dustymabe> and I see them often at meetups
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2015-12-03T16:44:08  <dustymabe> and how long ago was that?
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2015-12-03T16:44:44  <tmrts> I replied that we'd like to merge efforts as well and what do you think the next action should be
2015-12-03T16:45:06  <Bahhumbug> My apologies for dropping the bot in the middle of your meeting.  I don't believe meetbot will be able to recover gracefully from this action.
2015-12-03T16:45:15  <tmrts> this was a week ago and he said that we should start by contributing to coreos-ci
2015-12-03T16:45:34  <dustymabe> tmrts: ok cool
2015-12-03T16:46:05  <dustymabe> basically what we need to do is float the idea of the combined organization with them
2015-12-03T16:46:34  <dustymabe> and as long as they understand that is our goal and they agree it is their goal  too then I don't see any problem with contributing code to their GH for now
2015-12-03T16:46:40  <Bahhumbug> If anyone needs raw bot logs from the meeting (sans the ~2 minutes it was down, obviously) please ping me and I will be happy to provide them.
2015-12-03T16:46:46  <dustymabe> to ease the migration to the new org
2015-12-03T16:47:06  <tmrts> I'll mention that we'd be more comfortable with a combined organization and help with the migration
2015-12-03T16:47:16  <dustymabe> Bahhumbug: jbrooks will probably need them to post to the list
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2015-12-03T16:47:27  <dustymabe> tmrts: feel free to add me to the emails
2015-12-03T16:47:41  <tmrts> yeah I'll cc you
2015-12-03T16:47:56  <dustymabe> thanks
2015-12-03T16:47:56  <Bahhumbug> Ping me at the end of your meeting and I'll make them available.  I no longer camp this channel.
2015-12-03T16:47:56  <jbrooks> Bahhumbug, yes please, I'm at jbrooks at redhat.com
2015-12-03T16:47:56  <dustymabe> I like this strategy
2015-12-03T16:47:56  <Bahhumbug> Again, my apologies.
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2015-12-03T16:48:24  <dustymabe> tmrts++
2015-12-03T16:48:47  <dustymabe> tmrts: how much time do you have to devote to this effort?
2015-12-03T16:49:02  <dustymabe> is it a primary thing or is it something that is a side project for you?
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2015-12-03T16:49:51  <dustymabe> once we get a clear path to success what we can do is promote what we are doing and get more people interested in the project
2015-12-03T16:50:32  <tmrts> dustymabe, I was worked on it during the summer as part of GSoC. At the moment it is a side-project. That is one of my concerns as well I might not be able to devote enough time
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2015-12-03T16:51:15  <dustymabe> tmrts: got ya
2015-12-03T16:51:20  <dustymabe> ok I'll keep that in mind
2015-12-03T16:52:02  <jbrooks> OK, are we all set for now?
2015-12-03T16:52:12  <dustymabe> I think so
2015-12-03T16:52:17  <kbsingh> can Arrfab / Evolution, not push the logs directly to www.centos.org ?
2015-12-03T16:52:18  <tmrts> yes I think so as well
2015-12-03T16:52:29  <jbrooks> I guess there isn't a meeting to end?
2015-12-03T16:52:37  <jbrooks> #endmeeting