[CentOS] [OT][Practices] The Case for RBAC/MAC

Craig White craigwhite at azapple.com
Sun Nov 20 02:10:47 UTC 2005

On Sat, 2005-11-19 at 23:30 +0100, Dag Wieers wrote:
> On Fri, 18 Nov 2005, Craig White wrote:
> > On Fri, 2005-11-18 at 22:07 -0500, Sam Drinkard wrote:
> > 
> > > Craig, it's not about being interested or disinterested.  The
> > > discussion has completely turned into a urinating contest between
> > > those that will and those that won't.  Yes, I know how to delete
> > > things, but is still fills up the mailbox with unnecessary chatter.  I
> > > don't think I'm alone in wanting the thread to go away either.  3 or 4
> > > days worth is enough.  Take it to personal e-mail.  I'm in learning
> > > stages with CentOS and linux in general.  I sure can't learn anything
> > > from this conversation other than who can create the longest post.
> >
> > so if there's 10 of you that want the thread to die and there's 1000
> > people subscribed does that make it significant?
> Maybe the 990 others are sensible enough to not add their own voice to the 
> current noisy mess in order to save whatsever left of this list. At least 
> they didn't join the endless discussion.
that's certainly possible
> > There are a lot of sysadmins on this list - the interchange is
> > interesting in that there is a wide range of opinions.
> Sure, but do I want to listen to the same opinion (from the same 
> hard-head) 5 times with little added value ? Not really.
> If it was just about voicing different opinions, I don't think anyone 
> would disagree.
there are a few that will argue an obtuse tangential point or a
ridiculous proposition rather than give up and even leave the impression
that they might have been wrong and there are those on this list that
can't fathom advice that they believe in their heart to be wrong.

So they go on and on. I have barely participated and it should be
obvious to the participants that it is long past time to let go but
unless we conspire to shout people down, they have a right to speak
their piece. Most of them have been respectful.
> > We all have the ability to delete the messages...it takes but a second
> > and it seems to me that your opposition to the continuation of the
> > thread probably has more to do with the participants than the discussion
> > itself - but let me assure you that the participants are very
> > knowledgeable people - perhaps too sarcastic at times but knowledgable.
> It's not about deleting a message or ignoring a thread. It's the time 
> reading and then deciding to delete that is being wasted. You don't know 
> if something is garbage until you actually spend time reading it. 
> (Multiplied by the number of people that do not care)
> Plus, the threads make this list's atmosphere very, very unfriendly. And 
> it's not like it happened once or twice. The same people are involved and 
> the same people force their opinion (whenever there's opposition, and 
> there always is). If people could just state their opinion once and leave 
> it at that if someone disagrees all would be fine.
I think you can drop a personal note to them directly. I certainly have
> > Sometimes it's worth perusing through useless discussions to help me
> > judge who really knows their stuff and who bluffs and blunders their way
> > through things.
> And for most it's a waste of time to see people fight and flame. It's not 
> good for the atmosphere, the list or CentOS. Remember this is the main 
> CentOS list where people subscribe to get help and most I see is long 
> threads with people wanting (aching) to be right and defaming other 
> people to get there.
well - I know for certain that perhaps only 1 or 2 of them will ever
actually say...yeah, you're right. Those things just are never gonna
happen here. On the positive side...there hasn't been any flaming going
on either.


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