Warren Young wrote:
> On 2/13/2013 06:12, mark wrote:
>> Huh. No, I want to pay on the order of $12/individual battery,
>
> Please don't misuse "order." It's a corruption of the scientific term
> "order of magnitude"[1][2] which, used correctly, means that the values
> you're comparing use the same factor of 10 in scientific notation. If
> we take your claim literally, you'd be satisfied with any complete
> battery that cost less than $120 * 8 = $960.
Now, this is serious nitpicking, and it also argues over common usage. But
if you *really* want to get into it, I could note that I want on the
order, base 2.
>
> (I will also come after you if you misuse "literally". :) )
>
>> $100 or so for the set of 8;
>
> You've got one low-ball quote, and now you're demanding that everyone
> else meet it? Sigh...
I take it you haven't done a lot of purchasing, where alternatives were
considered? APC offers it at the highest price for their own UPSes. Many
other companies offer compatibles, and this kind of rate - the lower one -
is what I've been paying for over three years.
Actually, since of the three or four with the ballpark (go ahead, argue
*that*) of $100 for the set of 8, none offer GSA, I've checked with my
manager, and I'll just go ahead and get three quotes for open market
value.
<snip>
> Given how many news stories you can find about misbehaving cheap
> batteries, I'd bet on option a). Just because the label has the same
> voltage and amp-hour rating as what came out of the APC UPS, doesn't
> mean it's exactly the same thing. Batteries are tricky. Boeing and
> Tesla Motors are both in the news now because too few people really
> understand batteries.
No. The only *real* issue is getting the vendor to understand that every
single battery manufacturer is lying, because they *haven't* tested them
on rackmount server UPSes, and yes, I don't care what the OEM says - and
I've spoken, personally, to two or three OEMs - they MUST be HR (high
rate) batteries; nothing else will make the UPSes happy.
The compatible batteries I've bought and put in the UPSes in '10 are only
*starting* to go, so three years (including '10, since most of them were
in the first half of the years) isn't bad, esp, when, with our "wonderful"
power that blinks at least once a day to the server rooms, they do get
hit.
>
> If you're willing to open up the APC sled and replace the individual
> VRLAs directly, the cheapest *reputable* vendor I've found is Mouser.
> Their part # 632-GP1245 looks close, but don't take my word on that.
> I'm just eyeballing photos and springboarding off the McMaster
> dimensions; I have no direct experience on that particular swap.
Oh, sorry if I wasn't clear: that's what I do, open the sled and replace
with the new set of eight individual batteries. Not a big deal.
<snip>
> When you buy individual VRLAs, you have to account for your time opening
> up the sled, swapping VRLAs, and reassembling it all. Then you add in
> your time to dispose of the spent VRLAs. I'm sure you can find plenty
> of places locally that will take them, but I'll bet your salary and gas
> costs will wipe out your DIY savings.
Nope. I bring the old batteries to my cube, and when I've got enough to
make it worth it, I call the folks in hazardous waste who explicitly take
care of recycling batteries, and they come get them.
>
> You're probably not counting opportunity costs[4], either.
And you're not looking at the bigger picture: I'm a sysadmin. We're not
overworked, though there's plenty to do. The Republicans in Congress
pretend to cut the budget; therefore, saving the US gov't, in the form of
my division, budget dollars, since I'm on a fixed rate, is cheaper than
trying to get more money out of Congress to save my time by shipping the
entire sled and recycling that.
mark