On Oct 18, 2018, at 9:41 AM, mark <m.roth at 5-cent.us> wrote: > On 10/17/18 7:55 PM, Warren Young wrote: >>> Benno Rice is right: Lennart Poettering gets stuff done. > > Because he's funded. There are plenty of people with jobs that don’t get stuff done. > I strongly suspect that a lot of that funding > comes from M$'s interest in Upstream. Soooo…systemd is a Microsoft conspiracy against Linux? > my home workstation is CentOS 6, and I am NOT > looking forward to EOL. That’s what I meant with my comment about the technical debt bill coming due. You can’t ignore the changes in the external world forever. The OpenSSL issue brought up in a prior post is another example of the same basic problem. > people are tired of screaming and yelling about > systemd, because we've had years now of the response being "tough, it's > the Wave of the Future" We covered that back when RHEL 7 was still in beta: the time is far too late to change the init system of RHEL 7. The fact that you’re tired of being ignored doesn’t enter into it: you could still be yelling about it, and it still wouldn’t change. Red Has simply isn’t going to swap out its Enterprise Linux init system within a major release cycle. I believe it’s certain that RHEL 8 (and thus CentOS 8) will also be systemd-based, since we’d be hearing about the change by now via Fedora if it were otherwise. Those of you who want a systemd-free CentOS-like OS to be available before CentOS 6 hits EOL are going to have to see to that yourselves. You cannot expect it to just drop from the sky. > Poettering is like upper management: they > know, I mean, Everything, so why should they need to talk to end users (or > working sysadmins)? The suggestion that Red Hat is not listening to working system administrators beggars belief. That’s pretty much the basis of their company’s major income stream. What Red Hat is not doing is filling every demand from all working system administrators. They’re choosing which demands to address, as any software project management must. Red Hat has certainly heard the screams of the reactionaries. Since that hasn’t changed anything, I believe you have your demand’s answer. So, what are you going to do about it?