My apologies for this because it is, technically, OT, but it is a classic example of what rotten support Linux (and CentOS) get in the US from equipment manufacturers. The whole email is a lie because they DO have the drivers on their asia site, they just don't want us 'Murkins to get our hands on them. Or maybe it's part of some clever little nuance of their agreement with Micro$oft not to provide the Linux drivers so they can have the rights to distribute the Window$ drivers with the printers.
Maybe I should advertise this - canonmp160.ppd available here (and put up a web site for it).
---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: Canon Support - MFP mfp@cits.canon.com Date: Apr 15, 2007 11:13 AM Subject: Re: Response from Canon - MultiPASS (KMM7153196V60774L0KM) To: Mark Hull-Richter mhullrich@gmail.com
Dear Mark:
Thank you for writing to us. We value you as a Canon customer and appreciate the opportunity to assist you. I apologize for the difficulty you are having with finding a Linux driver for the MP160.
Canon does not support Linux on its consumer products and therefore a driver for Linux is not available through Canon. I can only recommend checking with sites such as linux-drivers.org or any other third party that may have successfully written a Linux driver for your product.
Please let us know if we can be of any further assistance with your MP160.
Thank you for choosing Canon.
Sincerely,
Karl Technical Support Representative
Special Note: Certain issues are very difficult to resolve via email. If your question remains unanswered after you have received this email, you may call our special toll-free number for email customers with unresolved issues and speak to a technician* by dialing 1-866-261-9362, Monday - Friday 8:00 a.m. - 12:00 midnight ET, and Saturday 10:00 a.m. - 8:00 p.m. ET (excluding holidays).
If you prefer to continue to communicate via email, reply to this message and we will respond as quickly as possible.
*Telephone support for products no longer covered under the manufacturer's warranty may require a $9.99 fee for support.
Original Message Follows: -------------------------
Email Support Form Message Product Type: PIXMA MP160 Product Model: IslandData Session: Product Serial Number: JCGA97085 Date of Purchase: 04/12/2007 First Name: Mark Last Name: Hull-Richter Address: City: State: Zip: 92705 Phone Number: Email Address: mhullrich@gmail.com EMAIL_ADDRESS_CONFIRM: mhullrich@gmail.com q01: USB q02: Other q03: Driver_Installation INQUIRY: I am running CetnOS 4.4 on my PC and you do not have any drivers for Linux systems listed on your site (or anywhere on the web that I can find). Please provide a Linux driver for this printer so I can use it. Thank you.
On Sun, 15 Apr 2007 at 2:44pm, Mark Hull-Richter wrote
My apologies for this because it is, technically, OT, but it is a classic example of what rotten support Linux (and CentOS) get in the US from equipment manufacturers. The whole email is a lie because they DO have the drivers on their asia site, they just don't want us 'Murkins to get our hands on them. Or maybe it's part of some clever little nuance of their agreement with Micro$oft not to provide the Linux drivers so they can have the rights to distribute the Window$ drivers with the printers.
Maybe I should advertise this - canonmp160.ppd available here (and put up a web site for it).
Vote with your wallet -- return the useless POS and buy something that *is* supported.
Joshua Baker-LePain wrote:
Vote with your wallet -- return the useless POS and buy something that *is* supported.
so what color photo printers are supported in Linux? My personal color printer at home is the Canon i9900, which is connected via USB2 to a WindowsXP system, I don't have much experience trying to do photo printing from Linux, in fact the last time I did any color printing from Unix or Linux, it was on a color Postscript laser printer, and it was nowheres near photo quality.
ditto, multifunction SOHO copier/printer/fax/scanner machines (which is what I'm presuming the MP160 is). Those typically are 90% host software, and require all-in-one application software running on the host system to manage their copier and fax functionality. How would you propose a consumer electronics oriented company support Linux? Which glibc should they link with? which version of gnome/gtk/kde/what should they build their app with? just give the user a source tarball and say 'have fun compiling'?
On 4/15/07, John R Pierce pierce@hogranch.com wrote:
so what color photo printers are supported in Linux? My personal color printer at home is the Canon i9900, which is connected via USB2 to a WindowsXP system, I don't have much experience trying to do photo printing from Linux, in fact the last time I did any color printing from Unix or Linux, it was on a color Postscript laser printer, and it was nowheres near photo quality.
ditto, multifunction SOHO copier/printer/fax/scanner machines (which is what I'm presuming the MP160 is). Those typically are 90% host software, and require all-in-one application software running on the host system to manage their copier and fax functionality. How would you propose a consumer electronics oriented company support Linux? Which glibc should they link with? which version of gnome/gtk/kde/what should they build their app with? just give the user a source tarball and say 'have fun compiling'?
That's an interesting point, but it's sad, too, because it makes Linux the limping straggler following behind the great M$ iron horse Window$. Or is there an alternative for Linux that does print photo-quality photo images?
Would it be so difficult to send the source to the major distributors (RH, SUSE, to name two) so they could include quality printer support in the distros? (Yeah, I know, more work for the distro developers, but that IS the business they're in....)
mhr
That's an interesting point, but it's sad, too, because it makes Linux the limping straggler following behind the great M$ iron horse Window$. Or is there an alternative for Linux that does print photo-quality photo images?
Would it be so difficult to send the source to the major distributors (RH, SUSE, to name two) so they could include quality printer support in the distros? (Yeah, I know, more work for the distro developers, but that IS the business they're in....)
if its open source, the kernel driverss at least need to be adopted by the kernel group. RH at least, has gone on record as saying they don't want to introduce non-kernel-standard drivers any more, and I can't say I blame them. Its almost impossible for 3rd party hardware vendors to support proprietary drivers anymore without making the end user compile them for each kernel rev (and each kernel microrev update breaks said drivers until they are reinstalled).
I don't know if Linux has standard APIs for controlling fax modems and page scanners (I only use Unix and Linux as servers, not as a desktop environment). Certainly, these sorts of things never existed in the conventional POSIX view of the world. If it does, then the desktop application for copying/faxing/etc would be relatively hardware independent and could be a seperate generic opensource project.... OTOH, this sort of approach tends to reduce all hardware to lowest common denominator functionality.
Mark Hull-Richter wrote:
On 4/15/07, John R Pierce pierce@hogranch.com wrote:
so what color photo printers are supported in Linux? My personal color printer at home is the Canon i9900, which is connected via USB2 to a WindowsXP system, I don't have much experience trying to do photo printing from Linux, in fact the last time I did any color printing from Unix or Linux, it was on a color Postscript laser printer, and it was nowheres near photo quality.
ditto, multifunction SOHO copier/printer/fax/scanner machines (which is what I'm presuming the MP160 is). Those typically are 90% host software, and require all-in-one application software running on the host system to manage their copier and fax functionality. How would you propose a consumer electronics oriented company support Linux? Which glibc should they link with? which version of gnome/gtk/kde/what should they build their app with? just give the user a source tarball and say 'have fun compiling'?
That's an interesting point, but it's sad, too, because it makes Linux the limping straggler following behind the great M$ iron horse Window$. Or is there an alternative for Linux that does print photo-quality photo images?
Would it be so difficult to send the source to the major distributors (RH, SUSE, to name two) so they could include quality printer support in the distros? (Yeah, I know, more work for the distro developers, but that IS the business they're in....)
If I were a vendor and they offered me the source, I would say "post it at sourceforge or savanagh under an approved OSS licence, and then we'll look at it."
Mark Hull-Richter wrote:
That's an interesting point, but it's sad, too, because it makes Linux the limping straggler following behind the great M$ iron horse Window$. Or is there an alternative for Linux that does print photo-quality photo images?
How does it make Linux a "limping straggler" because some 3rd party device manufacturer doesn't actively write a driver? I would think that makes Canon the "limping straggler." My Minolta Magicolor 2450 has native Linux drivers (at least the last time I checked). I bought it after a series of HP inkjet and color laserjets failed in pretty short order. It works great!
HP products tend to have decent linux support too, but I've had a run of bad luck with their hardware so I don't buy from them anymore.
Cheers,
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On Sun, Apr 15, 2007 at 06:52:41PM -0400, chrism@imntv.com wrote:
HP products tend to have decent linux support too, but I've had a run of bad luck with their hardware so I don't buy from them anymore.
Well, I had some experiences with a few HP laser printers, if you can call them that, that did have issues. But not only with Linux. They sucked in pretty much any platform (namely, HP 1000 and HP 1020). Even more models that, even tho didn't totally suck, were pretty lame (HP 1022n comes to mind).
Believe it or not, I have a Lexmark E210 here. Old, cheap, and works like a charm.
Who ever though I would say something about about Lexmark ... tsc tsc. Shame on me.
- -- Rodrigo Barbosa "Quid quid Latine dictum sit, altum viditur" "Be excellent to each other ..." - Bill & Ted (Wyld Stallyns)
try linuxprinting.org..:)
John R Pierce wrote:
Joshua Baker-LePain wrote:
Vote with your wallet -- return the useless POS and buy something that *is* supported.
so what color photo printers are supported in Linux? My personal color printer at home is the Canon i9900, which is connected via USB2 to a WindowsXP system, I don't have much experience trying to do photo printing from Linux, in fact the last time I did any color printing from Unix or Linux, it was on a color Postscript laser printer, and it was nowheres near photo quality.
ditto, multifunction SOHO copier/printer/fax/scanner machines (which is what I'm presuming the MP160 is). Those typically are 90% host software, and require all-in-one application software running on the host system to manage their copier and fax functionality. How would you propose a consumer electronics oriented company support Linux? Which glibc should they link with? which version of gnome/gtk/kde/what should they build their app with? just give the user a source tarball and say 'have fun compiling'? _______________________________________________ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
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Get a networked printer and avoid the whole USB interfacing nonsense.
Chris:
That's a nice, glib answer, but not an option from my end.
I returned the Canon printer, and will never buy another one.
Thank you for your support, and Canon's.
Regards.
mhr
On 4/28/07, Chris Mason (Lists) lists@masonc.com wrote:
Get a networked printer and avoid the whole USB interfacing nonsense.
-- Chris Mason (264) 497-5670 Fax: (264) 497-8463 Int: (305) 704-7249 Fax: (815)301-9759 UK 44.207.183.0271 Cell: 264-235-5670 Yahoo IM: netconcepts_anguilla@yahoo.com
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CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
On 4/28/07, Chris Mason (Lists) lists@masonc.com wrote:
Get a networked printer and avoid the whole USB interfacing nonsense.
My apologies: It's been a really long weekend and I typed faster than I read....
1) I top posted. Goof 1.
2) For some rason, I thought this was a response from Canon. Goof 2.
Chris:
Seriously, that isn't an option from my end, but I did return the printer and probably will never buy another Canon printer. My attraction to them died when I had to return my wife's IP4300 (an exchange for her IP4200, and exchange for her IP4000) to get another one about six months after the exchange. What a collection of trash!
Anyone know where I can find a good inexpensive scanner?
Thanks.
On Monday 30 April 2007 01:28, Mark Hull-Richter wrote:
On 4/28/07, Chris Mason (Lists) lists@masonc.com wrote:
Get a networked printer and avoid the whole USB interfacing nonsense.
My apologies: It's been a really long weekend and I typed faster than I read....
I top posted. Goof 1.
For some rason, I thought this was a response from Canon. Goof 2.
Chris:
Seriously, that isn't an option from my end, but I did return the printer and probably will never buy another Canon printer. My attraction to them died when I had to return my wife's IP4300 (an exchange for her IP4200, and exchange for her IP4000) to get another one about six months after the exchange. What a collection of trash!
Anyone know where I can find a good inexpensive scanner?
Thanks.
Mark,
I don't know what you consider inexpensive but my home network uses two Brother MFC-5440CN multifunction units. I have them on a network but they do have USB interfaces and the Brother Linux driver support pages have drivers which work well under Centos 4.x and 5.0 . The Brother Linux support page is http://solutions.brother.com/linux/en_us/index.html if interrested. These units work quite well under both Linux and M$ and the print cartridges are cheap (aftermarket around $5 US).
-w.arkwolf
On Monday 30 April 2007 01:28, Mark Hull-Richter wrote:
[snip]
Anyone know where I can find a good inexpensive scanner?
We have a good experience with HP printers. Recently, we took a xerox phaser printer - so far I am pleased.
This information relates to office printers, but may indicate what to be expected from these companies in regard to linux support.
Cheers,
Mark Hull-Richter wrote:
My apologies: It's been a really long weekend and I typed faster than I read....
I top posted. Goof 1.
For some rason, I thought this was a response from Canon. Goof 2.
Chris:
Seriously, that isn't an option from my end, but I did return the printer and probably will never buy another Canon printer. My attraction to them died when I had to return my wife's IP4300 (an exchange for her IP4200, and exchange for her IP4000) to get another one about six months after the exchange. What a collection of trash!
Anyone know where I can find a good inexpensive scanner?
Thanks.
I have an HP Deskjet 3745 printer and an HP Scanjet 2200c scanner, and both work OK with CentOS 5.0.
Previously while on SL 4.x, the scanner worked OK too, and the printer required the hplip package to work OK, but CentOS 5.0 comes with it.
HP products work well with GNU/Linux.
Everyone,
I am looking for a terminal screen Word Perfect replacement for CentOS 5.0 and would like to evaluate jed from jedsoft.org. Do any of you have an rpm for this for CentOS 5.0?
Greg Ennis
John R Pierce wrote:
Joshua Baker-LePain wrote:
Vote with your wallet -- return the useless POS and buy something that *is* supported.
so what color photo printers are supported in Linux? My personal color printer at home is the Canon i9900, which is connected via USB2 to a WindowsXP system, I don't have much experience trying to do photo printing from Linux, in fact the last time I did any color printing from Unix or Linux, it was on a color Postscript laser printer, and it was nowheres near photo quality.
Almost certainly HP. Last time I enquired, the reply was "all current and planned devices."
Probably Epson - Epson helps.
Mark Hull-Richter wrote:
My apologies for this because it is, technically, OT, but it is a classic example of what rotten support Linux (and CentOS) get in the US from equipment manufacturers. The whole email is a lie because they DO have the drivers on their asia site, they just don't want us 'Murkins to get our hands on them. Or maybe it's part of some clever little nuance of their agreement with Micro$oft not to provide the Linux drivers so they can have the rights to distribute the Window$ drivers with the printers.
My only surprise is you bought Canon.
HP actively supports Linux, over time it's had several projects at sf.net, and I've even exchanged email with HP developers.
On 4/15/07, John Summerfield debian@herakles.homelinux.org wrote:
My only surprise is you bought Canon.
Cheap, reasonably reliable, and they produce good printouts.
HP actively supports Linux, over time it's had several projects at
sf.net, and I've even exchanged email with HP developers.
$$$$$ - the ONLY reason I don't use HP. This is for home use. This one time I needed a scanner, and the MP160 was (uh oh, I know I'm going to regret saying this) refurbished and available for less than any scanner around, PLUS I occasionally like to produce color printouts. At least I have XP-on-VMWare as a backup for printing those things that Linux won't, like most of my graphics pdfs (AR prints them on Windows, kills the printer on Linux), any image file (same thing for gimp vs. Photoshop Elements 2.0 or even the Windows file viewer), certain web pages that just don't print right in SeaMonkey (or Firefox) on Linux but are fine in SeaMonkey or IE from Windows.
God! I hate to admit it when anything works better in Windows, but at least the OS doesn't.... :-)
mhr
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On Sun, Apr 15, 2007 at 03:45:56PM -0700, Mark Hull-Richter wrote:
God! I hate to admit it when anything works better in Windows, but at least the OS doesn't.... :-)
I find it only fair to admit some things work better on Windows. At least, if you want people to take you seriously when you say something works better on Linux. (Yes, I did notice the emoticon, I'm just taking the oportunity here).
We (ALL of we) consider it absurd when people try to use Windows for every single thing, from Firewalls and Routers, Mobile devices, CAD stations etc. Shouldn't we consider it absurd when people try to convince you that Linux is "da best" for every thing ?
Yes, I use and recomend Linux. Mostly. In some cases, I recomend Solaris (on Sparc) and others, among then Windows.
I try to be fair and, even tho I do think Windows sucks for MOST uses, it does outstands on a few. Same goes for most other operating systems. Heck, even HP/UX has its uses.
Best Regards,
- -- Rodrigo Barbosa "Quid quid Latine dictum sit, altum viditur" "Be excellent to each other ..." - Bill & Ted (Wyld Stallyns)
On Sun, 2007-04-15 at 14:44 -0700, Mark Hull-Richter wrote:
My apologies for this because it is, technically, OT, but it is a classic example of what rotten support Linux (and CentOS) get in the US from equipment manufacturers. The whole email is a lie because they DO have the drivers on their asia site, they just don't want us 'Murkins to get our hands on them. Or maybe it's part of some clever little nuance of their agreement with Micro$oft not to provide the Linux drivers so they can have the rights to distribute the Window$ drivers with the printers.
Maybe I should advertise this - canonmp160.ppd available here (and put up a web site for it).
You've got me curious. I went to one of Canon's Asia sites and they DO list a Linux driver for the MP160. Have you tried it? Does it work? Just wondering.
Fred
-
Chris Mason (Lists) -
chrism＠imntv.com -
Fred Erickson -
Gregory P. Ennis -
Ioannis Vranos -
Itay -
John R Pierce -
John Summerfield -
Joshua Baker-LePain -
Mark Hull-Richter -
Rodrigo Barbosa -
w.arkwolf -
William Warren