On Wed, 2005-10-19 at 17:24 +0200, Farkas Levente wrote:

Karanbir Singh wrote:

...

Hi guys,

Just to let everyone know that the CentOS 4.1 tree will be dropped from the mirrors shortly, since 4.2 has now been out for a week. If anyone has their yum config's hardwired to point at 4.1 - those config's will now stop working.

The 4.1 repo's will be available at http://vault.centos.org/ once they are removed from http://mirror.centos.org/ ( and all external mirrors ).

If you wish to stay with 4.1, keep in mind that updates and security fix's are no longer pushed out for 4.1, and therefore we recommend everyone moves to 4.2, if you have not already done so.

why not happend the same with the 3.x dirs?

It is the same as the 3.x distros

the 3.x distros all point to the latest distro ... 3, 3.1, 3.3, 3.4 and 3.5 are all 3.5 (everything is a symlink to 3.5).

Just like with the upstream provider ... they do not have a EL4 update 1 section and an el4 update 2 section, etc. If you use up2date or RHN to update a machine, it is updated to the latest EL4 updates. That is exactly the same thing that will happen if you are using CentOS-4.

On Wed, 2005-10-19 at 16:24 -0500, Les Mikesell wrote:

On Wed, 2005-10-19 at 10:38, Johnny Hughes wrote:

...

Just like with the upstream provider ... they do not have a EL4 update 1 section and an el4 update 2 section, etc. If you use up2date or RHN to update a machine, it is updated to the latest EL4 updates. That is exactly the same thing that will happen if you are using CentOS-4.

If you install today with 4.0 or 4.1 isos and update via up2date or yum, won't you miss any updates that were rolled into the subsequent base isos and omitted in current updates?

Not if you have and official CentOS [base] and [updates] in your yum configuration.

Base + updates on any Official CentOS tree is always the latest packages required for a full install ... just like the packages in RHN.

On 10/19/05, BRUCE STANLEY bruce.stanley@prodigy.net wrote:

--- Karanbir Singh mail-lists@karan.org wrote:

...

Hi guys,

Just to let everyone know that the CentOS 4.1 tree will be dropped from the mirrors shortly, since 4.2 has now been out for a week. If anyone has their yum config's hardwired to point at 4.1 - those config's will now stop working.

The 4.1 repo's will be available at http://vault.centos.org/ once they are removed from http://mirror.centos.org/ ( and all external mirrors ).

If you wish to stay with 4.1, keep in mind that updates and security fix's are no longer pushed out for 4.1, and therefore we recommend everyone moves to 4.2, if you have not already done so.

• K

-- Karanbir Singh : http://www.karan.org/ : 2522219@icq _______________________________________________

I thought each release of Centos had a longer support life cycye than this.

What then is the difference (in this respect) then between Centos and Fedora Core?

CentOS follows the upstream and CentOS 4 support is much longer than Fedora Core. The upstream provider calls these updates and for support updates have to be applied as released.

CentOS provides the ability to "freeze" at a .X that is not available from the upstream provider. Since this is not provided upstream it will not receive updates.

HTH

-- Leonard Isham, CISSP Ostendo non ostento.

On Wednesday 19 October 2005 13:00, BRUCE STANLEY wrote:

Does this mean if Red Hat comes out with more updates for RHEL 4.1 you will not apply them to Centos 4.1 anny more?

Bruce, there is no such thing as RHEL 4.1. There is a RHEL4, update set 1 (a snapshot of updates, released quarterly). But RHEL 4.1 does not exist. Nor does RHEL 4.2, for that matter. Nor will they ever exist; the next version of RHEL will likely be version 5 (there is no .0 there, either).

Read "CentOS 4.2" as "CentOS 4, quarterly update rollup 2". I believe the use of a minor version number is a mistake for this reason, but that is the way CentOS does it.

On Wednesday 19 October 2005 13:06, Lance Davis wrote:

On Wed, 19 Oct 2005, Lamar Owen wrote:

...

Read "CentOS 4.2" as "CentOS 4, quarterly update rollup 2". I believe the use of a minor version number is a mistake for this reason, but that is the way CentOS does it.

maybe we should change it next time to 4u3 raher than 4.3 :)

Well, I for one am not confused about it. 4u3, 4.3, same difference to my mind. But obviously there are people who do have some confusion over it. I guess it boils down to a simple choice: spend a few minutes making the version numbers align with upstream (twiddling a few bits here and there) or writing an article/page on why this is the way it's done that takes more time, requires more work, uses more space, and still has to be referred to every time someone asks this question. It's all a matter of which is more work to the people doing the work. :-) I don't care either way, as it's just XOR'ing the release with 006B00. :-)

Humm.. Even Red Hat is supporting RHEL releases longer than this. We use RHEL AS Release with full support.

Not correct. RHEL is on RHEL 4 update 2. If you run up2date -fu, you will get the full updates. Follow that with a cat /etc/redhat-release and it will confirm thusly (note we use ES, not AS, but same applies):

[jperrin@xxxx ~]$ cat /etc/redhat-release Red Hat Enterprise Linux ES release 4 (Nahant Update 2) [jperrin@xxxx ~]$

it's the major version number that has the support, not the minor.

Does this mean if Red Hat comes out with more updates for RHEL 4.1 you will not apply them to Centos 4.1 any more?

All updates are being applied to the 4.2 tree now, just as upstream is applying them to AS4 update 2.

-- Jim Perrin System Administrator - UIT Ft Gordon & US Army Signal Center

On Wed, 2005-10-19 at 11:30 -0700, BRUCE STANLEY wrote:

--- Jim Perrin jperrin@gmail.com wrote:

...

...

Humm.. Even Red Hat is supporting RHEL releases longer than this. We use RHEL AS Release with full support.

Not correct. RHEL is on RHEL 4 update 2. If you run up2date -fu, you will get the full updates. Follow that with a cat /etc/redhat-release and it will confirm thusly (note we use ES, not AS, but same applies):

[jperrin@xxxx ~]$ cat /etc/redhat-release Red Hat Enterprise Linux ES release 4 (Nahant Update 2) [jperrin@xxxx ~]$

it's the major version number that has the support, not the minor.

...

Does this mean if Red Hat comes out with more updates for RHEL 4.1 you will not apply them to Centos 4.1 any more?

All updates are being applied to the 4.2 tree now, just as upstream is applying them to AS4 update 2.

-- Jim Perrin System Administrator - UIT Ft Gordon & US Army Signal Center _______________________________________________ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos

Hi Jim!

I not real concerned with how the numbering of releases are done.

This is what I am concerned with: 1). Don't see any need at this point to update from 4.1 to 4.2

it is an RHEL update set ... if you had RHEL 4 and updated, you would get update set 2 ... CentOS does the same thing.

2)... down the road... say 4.3 comes out and there are updates to a few packages I might need/want. 3). Can 4.1 be updated with these packages correctly or will there be a problem with rpm dependency/compatibility issues?

Maybe ... if you pick and choose individual updates, they may depend on other updates, but the versions are the same as upstream.

If issues arise, then it would seem to me you would have to do the MS service pack type of routine everytime a new version comes out.

Again ... our updates are like upstream.

I do not like to upgrad entire systems unless it is absolutely necessary.

You can always just upgrade individual packages ... but the upstream provider only has the latest packages available via RHN ... not all packages from the beginning of EL-4.

Running "yum update" or "up2date -u" on a CentOS-4 machine does the same thing that upgrading from RHN does. It takes you to the latest updates for all packages.

With CentOS, you can use vault.centos.org to get any of the packages that were released since the beginning of CentOS-4 ... you can also add excludes in your yum or up2date configurations to exclude updating certain packages.

Quoting BRUCE STANLEY bruce.stanley@prodigy.net:

I not real concerned with how the numbering of releases are done.

This is what I am concerned with: 1). Don't see any need at this point to update from 4.1 to 4.2

You don't have to. Disable automatic nightly updates and you are fine.

2)... down the road... say 4.3 comes out and there are updates to a few packages I might need/want. 3). Can 4.1 be updated with these packages correctly or will there be a problem with rpm dependency/compatibility issues?

Sure thing. You can cherry-pick what you want to update. Either run up2date and manually select packages you want to update if you prefer GUI, or specify what packages you want to update using yum on command line (for example "yum update kernel gcc" to updated kernel and gcc packages only). The RPM dependencies will be checked, you'll be informed what additional packages will be updated/installed in the process (to satisfy dependencies) and you'll be prompted if you want to proceed or not. If you are OK with the list of dependencies, chose to continue with the process. If you are not OK with updating some of dependant packages, choose to stop and no changes will be made to the system. Simple as that.

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Quoting BRUCE STANLEY bruce.stanley@prodigy.net:

Does this mean if Red Hat comes out with more updates for RHEL 4.1 you will not apply them to Centos 4.1 anny more?

"RHEL 4 Update 1 with more updates" is called RHEL 4 Update 2.

Red Hat doesn't make updates for 4.0 or 4.1 or 4.2. Red Hat makes updates for "4". There's no such thing as RHEL 4.1 specific update. Exactly the same thing as CentOS project does. If you have three machines, one installed from "original" RHEL4 set of CDs, one installed from RHEL4.1 set of CDs and one installed from RHEL4.2 set of CDs, and than update any single package using up2date, you'll get *exactly* the same RPM installed on all of them. Again, exactly the same thing as with CentOS. Try updating any single package on your RHEL 4.1 box. And than compare it with your fully updated RHEL 4.2 box. Same version, eh? Not only same version, it was downloaded from exactly the same file on Red Hat's site.

It is exactly the same thing Sun or Microsoft are doing with Solaris and Windows XP (if you haven't noticed, Solaris and WinXP installation CDs get changed from time to time without any change of the version of the product, usually there's only small print on the side identifying new CD/DVD revision).

The confusion you have is that you call CentOS 4.0 (4.1, 4.2). Think of it as CentOS 4. The number after the dot means only that you have specific set of updates installed. Nothing more and nothing less. Same thing as with Red Hat.

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I thought each release of Centos had a longer support life cycye than this.

It does. You're confusing major/minor versions. Centos4 will be around for ages, centos 4.1 is centos 4, plus the quarterly security updates etc, all rolled up in a new iso, so that you don't have to immediately download 200 updates after installing 4.0.

4.2 is 4.1, plus the next quarterly update.. and so on. It's not a new version, it's a rollup of the major version, plus updates. Same with version 3.

hughesjr had a link on centos.org at one time explaining the naming convention and it's relation to upstream vendor versions. I seem to have lost the link, but perhaps it's time to trot that out again. If someone following this thread has the link to version/naming convention, please post again to help clarify this.

What then is the difference (in this respect) then between Centos and Fedora Core?

Fedora core releases a new major version 2-3 times a year. centos releases a minor version update (essentially security errata rollup. think "windows servicepack" for lack of a better analogy) every few months.

-- Jim Perrin System Administrator - UIT Ft Gordon & US Army Signal Center

Lamar Owen wrote:

Packs. "If you want Security Update X for your system, you must update to Service Pack Y" first type things; the RHEL setup can force the use of the updates sooner than Microsoft would dare, and the CentOS echo forces it within a week (unless I'm missing a way to tell yum "grab security updates, but leave the Quarterly alone for now").

Not really. You can always install individual updates only.

As for your second comment, you can disable base in CentOS.repo (or whatever it is called) and leave only updates enabled. Around time of switch between 4.n and 4.n+1 you would need to check erratas and manually apply security fixes that were released as part of 4.n+1 (and not as an update to any particular 4.n). However note that if an security fix requires a particular version of package from 4.n+1, you are hosed (however, you still don't need to install all updates from 4.n+1, you need only the required packages to satisfy dependencies). If you have many systems, you might choose to create your own "updates" repository and populate it only with security updates and their dependencies (so you don't run in previously described problem). Then make this repository public for the rest of the folks that would like that functionality. If you are current with updates in your repo, you'll become very popular guy ;-)

If you are gringing on this "manual" step, remember that if you had real RHEL installed, you wouldn't really have this option at all. All Red Hat has is an big pool that contains all updates since RHEL 4 was initially released.