On Fri, Sep 19, 2008 at 08:55:04PM +0200, Niki Kovacs wrote:

Akemi Yagi a écrit :

...

Some info here:

http://planet.centos.org/

Thanks for the info.

Niki

but that doesn't say anything about how it is (or will be) resolved...

Are we expected to remove Audacity from our systems, or what?

(or drop the DAG repostiory)

Akemi Yagi a écrit :

I believe what Dag is saying is that, if you wish to use audacity, you cannot update wxGTK. Conversely, if you update wxGTK, you cannot use audacity. I'm sure he will eventually resolve the issue.

In the meantime, how are we supposed to go about to install AMule, VLC and Audacity on a *new* install? No problem to write an 'exclude=' line in /etc/yum.conf on existing systems so updates get currently ignored. IMHO these things should have been put to some testing repo first. I prefer having slightly outdated software rather than mutually excluding updates :o/

Speaking of it: any chance the nautilus-sendto dependency on a non-existing libgaim.so.0 will be resolved? This bug must have been around for a year IIRC. It's a pity one must first wget and rpm -ivh --nodeps nautilus-sendto before doing a groupinstall "GNOME Desktop Environment". But I guess this is an upstream problem.

Cheers,

Niki

Good Evening.

...

...

I believe what Dag is saying is that, if you wish to use audacity, you cannot update wxGTK. Conversely, if you update wxGTK, you cannot use audacity. I'm sure he will eventually resolve the issue.

In the meantime, how are we supposed to go about to install AMule, VLC and Audacity on a *new* install? No problem to write an 'exclude=' line in /etc/yum.conf on existing systems so updates get currently ignored. IMHO these things should have been put to some testing repo first. I prefer having slightly outdated software rather than mutually excluding updates :o/

Because this is not really a CentOS issue, I think it is best to take it to the rpmforge packagers' mailing list. For example, Fabian recently discussed wxGTK here:

http://lists.rpmforge.net/pipermail/packagers/2008-September/000709.html

Are there any updates on that? yum still complains about missing dependencies on an installation with aMule and wxGTK.

Best Regards Marcus

fred smith wrote:

On Mon, Sep 22, 2008 at 06:27:45PM +0200, Marcus Moeller wrote:

...

Good Evening.

...

...

...

I believe what Dag is saying is that, if you wish to use audacity, you cannot update wxGTK. Conversely, if you update wxGTK, you cannot use audacity. I'm sure he will eventually resolve the issue.

In the meantime, how are we supposed to go about to install AMule, VLC and Audacity on a *new* install? No problem to write an 'exclude=' line in /etc/yum.conf on existing systems so updates get currently ignored. IMHO these things should have been put to some testing repo first. I prefer having slightly outdated software rather than mutually excluding updates :o/

Because this is not really a CentOS issue, I think it is best to take it to the rpmforge packagers' mailing list. For example, Fabian recently discussed wxGTK here:

http://lists.rpmforge.net/pipermail/packagers/2008-September/000709.html

Are there any updates on that? yum still complains about missing dependencies on an installation with aMule and wxGTK.

So what's the proper workaround here? As far as I'm concerned, Dag has broken

echo "I have `rpm -qa | grep rf | wc -l` reasons to apologize."

-----Original Message----- From: centos-bounces@centos.org [mailto:centos-bounces@centos.org] On Behalf Of fred smith Sent: Monday, September 22, 2008 7:59 PM To: CentOS mailing list Subject: Re: [CentOS] Update troubles for wxGTK apps

<snip> <snip/>

So what's the proper workaround here? As far as I'm concerned, Dag has broken the update system on our Centos boxes. Is there any other way to allow my system to be updated than to disable using Dag's repo?

(not including removing Audacity--which I don't use a LOT, but I do use it.)

################################################### JohnStanley Writes:

Sure is, just use yum prioritys so when you do yum update it will exclude "DAGS-Repo". Just follow the tutorial on wiki.centos.org.

-----Original Message----- From: centos-bounces@centos.org [mailto:centos-bounces@centos.org] On Behalf Of fred smith Sent: Monday, September 22, 2008 10:09 PM To: 'CentOS mailing list' Subject: Re: [CentOS] Update troubles for wxGTK apps

On Mon, Sep 22, 2008 at 08:19:37PM -0400, John wrote:

-----Original Message----- From: centos-bounces@centos.org [mailto:centos-bounces@centos.org] On Behalf Of fred smith Sent: Monday, September 22, 2008 7:59 PM To: CentOS mailing list Subject: Re: [CentOS] Update troubles for wxGTK apps

<snip> <snip/>

So what's the proper workaround here? As far as I'm concerned, Dag has broken the update system on our Centos boxes. Is there any other way to allow my system to be updated than to disable using Dag's repo?

(not including removing Audacity--which I don't use a LOT, but I do use it.)

################################################### JohnStanley Writes:

Sure is, just use yum prioritys so when you do yum update it will exclude "DAGS-Repo". Just follow the tutorial on wiki.centos.org.

I've had that set up ever since I first added any repositories. I've got it set to a priority of 10, is there a better value to use?

# Name: RPMforge RPM Repository for Red Hat Enterprise 5 - dag # URL: http://rpmforge.net/ [rpmforge] name = Red Hat Enterprise $releasever - RPMforge.net - dag #baseurl = http://apt.sw.be/redhat/el5/en/$basearch/dag mirrorlist = http://apt.sw.be/redhat/el5/en/mirrors-rpmforge #mirrorlist = file:///etc/yum.repos.d/mirrors-rpmforge enabled = 1 protect = 0 gpgkey = file:///etc/pki/rpm-gpg/RPM-GPG-KEY-rpmforge-dag gpgcheck = 1 priority=10 ---------------------------------------------------------------------- JohnStanley Writes:

Where "protect = 0" in the above needs to be protect = 1 for all centos repos so then yum want pull in Updates from other repos that will break your install ans the centos repos need the highest priority. You may have to experiment with both installed, also however they may be conflicting against each other also. Therefor you may have to remove one. I know yum prioritys set to 1 in CentOSBase.repo will exclude any other repo when running yum update

This should help you understand it more, http://wiki.centos.org/PackageManagement/Yum/Priorities. Also there is the Protect Base yum pluging, http://wiki.centos.org/PackageManagement/Yum/ProtectBase.

HTH you, JohnStanley

On Tue, Sep 23, 2008 at 01:54:20AM -0400, John wrote:

-----Original Message----- From: centos-bounces@centos.org [mailto:centos-bounces@centos.org] On Behalf Of fred smith Sent: Monday, September 22, 2008 10:09 PM To: 'CentOS mailing list' Subject: Re: [CentOS] Update troubles for wxGTK apps

On Mon, Sep 22, 2008 at 08:19:37PM -0400, John wrote:

...

-----Original Message----- From: centos-bounces@centos.org [mailto:centos-bounces@centos.org] On Behalf Of fred smith Sent: Monday, September 22, 2008 7:59 PM To: CentOS mailing list Subject: Re: [CentOS] Update troubles for wxGTK apps

<snip> <snip/>

So what's the proper workaround here? As far as I'm concerned, Dag has broken the update system on our Centos boxes. Is there any other way to allow my system to be updated than to disable using Dag's repo?

(not including removing Audacity--which I don't use a LOT, but I do use it.)

################################################### JohnStanley Writes:

Sure is, just use yum prioritys so when you do yum update it will exclude "DAGS-Repo". Just follow the tutorial on wiki.centos.org.

I've had that set up ever since I first added any repositories. I've got it set to a priority of 10, is there a better value to use?

# Name: RPMforge RPM Repository for Red Hat Enterprise 5 - dag # URL: http://rpmforge.net/ [rpmforge] name = Red Hat Enterprise $releasever - RPMforge.net - dag #baseurl = http://apt.sw.be/redhat/el5/en/$basearch/dag mirrorlist = http://apt.sw.be/redhat/el5/en/mirrors-rpmforge #mirrorlist = file:///etc/yum.repos.d/mirrors-rpmforge enabled = 1 protect = 0 gpgkey = file:///etc/pki/rpm-gpg/RPM-GPG-KEY-rpmforge-dag gpgcheck = 1 priority=10

---

JohnStanley Writes:

Where "protect = 0" in the above needs to be protect = 1 for all centos repos so then yum want pull in Updates from other repos that will break your install ans the centos repos need the highest priority. You may have to experiment with both installed, also however they may be conflicting against each other also. Therefor you may have to remove one. I know yum prioritys set to 1 in CentOSBase.repo will exclude any other repo when running yum update

This should help you understand it more, http://wiki.centos.org/PackageManagement/Yum/Priorities. Also there is the Protect Base yum pluging, http://wiki.centos.org/PackageManagement/Yum/ProtectBase.

HTH you, JohnStanley

Thanks John for the info.

As far as I know I'm NOT using the protect feature/plugin. I purposely set up priorities back when I first installed Centos5 and purposely did NOT set up the protect stuff. I read the documentation on the wiki about it and decided that priorities made a lot more sense.

here's the first part of yum output, wherein it says nothing about any protections other than via priority:

Loading "priorities" plugin Loading "fastestmirror" plugin Loading mirror speeds from cached hostfile * pidgin: rpm.pidgin.im * rpmforge: ftp-stud.fht-esslingen.de * base: updates.interworx.info * updates: mirror.trouble-free.net * addons: mirrors.unbornmedia.com * extras: mirror.trouble-free.net Excluding Packages in global exclude list Finished 412 packages excluded due to repository priority protections Setting up Update Process Resolving Dependencies

I've got priorities in CentOS-Base.repo set to 1 except for centosplus and contrib which are 2. pidgin.repo has all three items set to priority of 40, and rpmforge.repo is set to 10.

Anybody see anything wrong with that?

On Tue, Sep 23, 2008 at 09:12:12AM +0200, Nicolas Thierry-Mieg wrote:

fred smith wrote:

...

On Mon, Sep 22, 2008 at 08:19:37PM -0400, John wrote:

...

So what's the proper workaround here? As far as I'm concerned, Dag has broken the update system on our Centos boxes. Is there any other way to allow my system to be updated than to disable using Dag's repo?

(not including removing Audacity--which I don't use a LOT, but I do use it.)

################################################### JohnStanley Writes:

Sure is, just use yum prioritys so when you do yum update it will exclude "DAGS-Repo". Just follow the tutorial on wiki.centos.org.

I've had that set up ever since I first added any repositories. I've got it set to a priority of 10, is there a better value to use?

yum priority is for giving priority to one repo over another... Totally irrelevant here, the the issues are rpmforge-only: the rf audacity needs GTK 2.6 while new builds of VLC and others (still rf) now need GTK 2.8. Both GTK 2.6 and GTK 2.8 are available in rpmforge. So, you have to choose your own priorities, no software can make the choice for you:

• either you upgrade GTK to 2.8, which requires uninstalling audacity

(until some time in the probably not so distant future where Dag resolves the issues and manages to build audacity with GTK 2.8);

• or you stick to GTK 2.6, which means you have to keep your older

versions of VLC and any other package whose newer versions were rebuilt with GTK 2.8.

Why is this such a big deal??

If it's really that critical to you, I'm sure Dag could use your help getting that audacity thing to build with GTK 2.8.

It's a big deal only in the sense that with a properly configured yum system I cannot update my system without disabling a repository that wants to give me incompatible updates, incompatible with itself.

I can certainly disable rpmforge, and as far as I can see that's my only option here unless I want to mess around with audacity. Somehow I was operating under the (apparent) delusion that the repo maintainers would ensure they didn't create situations like this, so that users wouldn't end up unable to update.

but if I don't want to do the devel work and especially if I was a user who didn't know how to disable a repo, I'd be stuck here. So I asked if there was any choice other than doing that. I've not heard that other people find it to be an issue, so maybe I'm just overly sensitive, but it seems like a breakage to me. What do I know.

I do not and did not mean to be offensive to Dag, and I apologize if I was--it just seemed like an issue that would be affecting a lot more people than just me and I wanted to see what others were doing about it. So far I've not heard what that is.

John a écrit :

I do not and did not mean to be offensive to Dag, and I apologize if I was--it just seemed like an issue that would be affecting a lot more people than just me and I wanted to see what others were doing about it. So far I've not heard what that is.

I second that. Dag is doing great work, and for desktop users, CentOS wouldn't be the same without RPMForge. However, this update has been botched up. Existing systems can be left in the present state by putting an 'exclude=wxGTK amule vlc audacity' line in /etc/yum.conf. But when installing a new system, 'yum install vlc audacity' does not work. This is a worry for me, as I install desktop systems professionally, and I use both programs on client's desktops (yes, amule too, when the client wants it... :o)). As far as I'm concerned, I worked around it by simply rebuilding wxGTK (2.6), amule, vlc and audacity from SRPM and putting them in my own repo with a higher priority. This took the best part of an afternoon.

My suggestion to Dag (with all respect taken): why not create a [rf-testing] repo for the critical stuff, a bit like [kbsingh]?

I repeat, since this is important: please do not take offense. Shit happens, I know.

Cheers,

Niki

Ralph Angenendt a écrit :

And if all that could be discussed on rpmforge users mailing list *where* other people from the rpmforge community also read and post, it would have been even greater >:)

Sorry for that.

Niki

On Wed, 24 Sep 2008, Niki Kovacs wrote:

John a écrit :

...

I do not and did not mean to be offensive to Dag, and I apologize if I was--it just seemed like an issue that would be affecting a lot more people than just me and I wanted to see what others were doing about it. So far I've not heard what that is.

I second that. Dag is doing great work, and for desktop users, CentOS wouldn't be the same without RPMForge. However, this update has been botched up. Existing systems can be left in the present state by putting an 'exclude=wxGTK amule vlc audacity' line in /etc/yum.conf. But when installing a new system, 'yum install vlc audacity' does not work. This is a worry for me, as I install desktop systems professionally, and I use both programs on client's desktops (yes, amule too, when the client wants it... :o)). As far as I'm concerned, I worked around it by simply rebuilding wxGTK (2.6), amule, vlc and audacity from SRPM and putting them in my own repo with a higher priority. This took the best part of an afternoon.

My suggestion to Dag (with all respect taken): why not create a [rf-testing] repo for the critical stuff, a bit like [kbsingh]?

Because I have no time for it. It is as simple as that.

And I prefer stop doing RPMforge than to spend more of my free time. rpmrepo was going to be RPMforge's successor (ATrpms, RPMforge, CentOS, all-in-one and community-based), but there is no progress there and that's why I am still here.

Currently, what I build is what becomes available. Often there is a delay because I want to make the repo as consistent as can be, but if a single package is holding back too many other packages I prefer to break the repo (I am using apt, apt can handle dependency-issues with no problem).

If someone want to step up and become a gatekeeper between a testing repository and a real rpmforge repository and shift the packages between, by all means do that and if it works, great. But I won't be doing that work and handle that complexity. I want to reduce the free time I spend maintaining packages I don't even use myself, not increase that time.

In this case audacity does not build against wxGTK 2.8.8, at least not on my system and nobody offered any help so far. A compat-wxGTK could be the solution, although compat-packages have a tendency to break even more with other repositories (and sadly Fedora opted NOT to follow Mandriva's lead in sensible package-names for libraries).

So that's the official word.

PS No waranties implied. No refund :-/

On Tue, 23 Sep 2008, fred smith wrote:

On Tue, Sep 23, 2008 at 09:12:12AM +0200, Nicolas Thierry-Mieg wrote:

...

fred smith wrote:

...

On Mon, Sep 22, 2008 at 08:19:37PM -0400, John wrote:

...

So what's the proper workaround here? As far as I'm concerned, Dag has broken the update system on our Centos boxes. Is there any other way to allow my system to be updated than to disable using Dag's repo?

(not including removing Audacity--which I don't use a LOT, but I do use it.)

################################################### JohnStanley Writes:

Sure is, just use yum prioritys so when you do yum update it will exclude "DAGS-Repo". Just follow the tutorial on wiki.centos.org.

I've had that set up ever since I first added any repositories. I've got it set to a priority of 10, is there a better value to use?

yum priority is for giving priority to one repo over another... Totally irrelevant here, the the issues are rpmforge-only: the rf audacity needs GTK 2.6 while new builds of VLC and others (still rf) now need GTK 2.8. Both GTK 2.6 and GTK 2.8 are available in rpmforge. So, you have to choose your own priorities, no software can make the choice for you:

• either you upgrade GTK to 2.8, which requires uninstalling audacity

(until some time in the probably not so distant future where Dag resolves the issues and manages to build audacity with GTK 2.8);

• or you stick to GTK 2.6, which means you have to keep your older

versions of VLC and any other package whose newer versions were rebuilt with GTK 2.8.

Why is this such a big deal??

If it's really that critical to you, I'm sure Dag could use your help getting that audacity thing to build with GTK 2.8.

It's a big deal only in the sense that with a properly configured yum system I cannot update my system without disabling a repository that wants to give me incompatible updates, incompatible with itself.

I can certainly disable rpmforge, and as far as I can see that's my only option here unless I want to mess around with audacity. Somehow I was operating under the (apparent) delusion that the repo maintainers would ensure they didn't create situations like this, so that users wouldn't end up unable to update.

but if I don't want to do the devel work and especially if I was a user who didn't know how to disable a repo, I'd be stuck here. So I asked if there was any choice other than doing that. I've not heard that other people find it to be an issue, so maybe I'm just overly sensitive, but it seems like a breakage to me. What do I know.

I do not and did not mean to be offensive to Dag, and I apologize if I was--it just seemed like an issue that would be affecting a lot more people than just me and I wanted to see what others were doing about it. So far I've not heard what that is.

Drop yum and use apt. At least apt will not just drop out but give a workable solution based on the packages you have installed and the possible solutions.

In fact I don't care about this breakage that much, because it should not be affecting you. Sadly, you are using yum.

Or you might be making yourself useful by trying to build audacity against the new environment (wxGTK) and let me know if you can make it work.

It is indeed sad that you cannot use yum anymore simply because there is a dependency issue. In fact, the most important reason for not mixing repositories is because yum dies on it, while other depsolvers give you solutions to make it work.

One might wonder why Red Hat choose the worst depsolver from the possibilities that existed at the time. And still hasn't improved the situation.

Of course the official word is: a repository should not break My response is: yum should not break :)

on 9-22-2008 7:08 PM fred smith spake the following:

On Mon, Sep 22, 2008 at 08:19:37PM -0400, John wrote:

...

-----Original Message----- From: centos-bounces@centos.org [mailto:centos-bounces@centos.org] On Behalf Of fred smith Sent: Monday, September 22, 2008 7:59 PM To: CentOS mailing list Subject: Re: [CentOS] Update troubles for wxGTK apps

<snip> <snip/>

So what's the proper workaround here? As far as I'm concerned, Dag has broken the update system on our Centos boxes. Is there any other way to allow my system to be updated than to disable using Dag's repo?

(not including removing Audacity--which I don't use a LOT, but I do use it.)

################################################### JohnStanley Writes:

Sure is, just use yum prioritys so when you do yum update it will exclude "DAGS-Repo". Just follow the tutorial on wiki.centos.org.

I've had that set up ever since I first added any repositories. I've got it set to a priority of 10, is there a better value to use?

# Name: RPMforge RPM Repository for Red Hat Enterprise 5 - dag # URL: http://rpmforge.net/ [rpmforge] name = Red Hat Enterprise $releasever - RPMforge.net - dag #baseurl = http://apt.sw.be/redhat/el5/en/$basearch/dag mirrorlist = http://apt.sw.be/redhat/el5/en/mirrors-rpmforge #mirrorlist = file:///etc/yum.repos.d/mirrors-rpmforge enabled = 1 protect = 0 gpgkey = file:///etc/pki/rpm-gpg/RPM-GPG-KEY-rpmforge-dag gpgcheck = 1 priority=10

Are you running protect and priorities at the same time? I do believe they aren't compatible, and don't work together.