Hi,
So, it seems that the current version of PHP in Centos 7 is PHP 5.4.16 however this version of PHP stopped getting security support from the PHP people one month ago [1].
Now, our developers want to use the new and shiny PHP because they want to use the latest version of Zend. They are proposing using this package [2] but I never heard of this repo.
Other than building the packages ourselves is there a more acceptable way to run a later version of PHP?
Thoughts? Experiences? Ramblings?
Ta,
Andrew
[1] - http://php.net/supported-versions.php [2] - https://webtatic.com/packages/php56/
Have a look at http://softwarecollections.org/ IUS could also be a good choice http://dl.iuscommunity.org/pub/ius/archive/CentOS/7/x86_64/
-- Sent from the Delta quadrant using Borg technology!
Nux! www.nux.ro
----- Original Message -----
From: "Andrew Holway" andrew.holway@gmail.com To: "centos" centos@centos.org Sent: Thursday, 22 October, 2015 16:31:46 Subject: [CentOS] PHP version not enough for developers
Hi,
So, it seems that the current version of PHP in Centos 7 is PHP 5.4.16 however this version of PHP stopped getting security support from the PHP people one month ago [1].
Now, our developers want to use the new and shiny PHP because they want to use the latest version of Zend. They are proposing using this package [2] but I never heard of this repo.
Other than building the packages ourselves is there a more acceptable way to run a later version of PHP?
Thoughts? Experiences? Ramblings?
Ta,
Andrew
[1] - http://php.net/supported-versions.php [2] - https://webtatic.com/packages/php56/ _______________________________________________ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org https://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
On 10/22/2015 10:31 AM, Andrew Holway wrote:
Hi,
So, it seems that the current version of PHP in Centos 7 is PHP 5.4.16 however this version of PHP stopped getting security support from the PHP people one month ago [1].
Now, our developers want to use the new and shiny PHP because they want to use the latest version of Zend. They are proposing using this package [2] but I never heard of this repo.
Other than building the packages ourselves is there a more acceptable way to run a later version of PHP?
Thoughts? Experiences? Ramblings?
I'm personally not a fan of the webtatic repository. This is mostly due to the number of users on irc who seem to have problems with it. I would recommend either the upcoming software collections packages or the IUS repository packages. https://iuscommunity.org/pages/About.html
IUS has been a very good/reliable way to get more recent versions of things, and the folks responsible for it are active both on irc and in the mailing lists.
On Thu, October 22, 2015 10:40 am, Jim Perrin wrote:
On 10/22/2015 10:31 AM, Andrew Holway wrote:
Hi,
So, it seems that the current version of PHP in Centos 7 is PHP 5.4.16 however this version of PHP stopped getting security support from the PHP people one month ago [1].
Now, our developers want to use the new and shiny PHP because they want to use the latest version of Zend. They are proposing using this package [2] but I never heard of this repo.
For me it sound like an example of the difference between "bleeding edge" and "enterprise" systems. The first is what developers most often like, the second is what humble sysadmins prefer as they have to keep something developed long ago running for as long as possible - and without crashed, daemons dying etc (== "bleeding" which always accompanies "bleeding edge" anything). Sorry for venting my own usual pain here...
Valeri
Other than building the packages ourselves is there a more acceptable way to run a later version of PHP?
Thoughts? Experiences? Ramblings?
I'm personally not a fan of the webtatic repository. This is mostly due to the number of users on irc who seem to have problems with it. I would recommend either the upcoming software collections packages or the IUS repository packages. https://iuscommunity.org/pages/About.html
IUS has been a very good/reliable way to get more recent versions of things, and the folks responsible for it are active both on irc and in the mailing lists.
-- Jim Perrin The CentOS Project | http://www.centos.org twitter: @BitIntegrity | GPG Key: FA09AD77 _______________________________________________ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org https://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Valeri Galtsev Sr System Administrator Department of Astronomy and Astrophysics Kavli Institute for Cosmological Physics University of Chicago Phone: 773-702-4247 ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Valeri Galtsev wrote:
On Thu, October 22, 2015 10:40 am, Jim Perrin wrote:
On 10/22/2015 10:31 AM, Andrew Holway wrote:
So, it seems that the current version of PHP in Centos 7 is PHP 5.4.16 however this version of PHP stopped getting security support from the PHP people one month ago [1].
Now, our developers want to use the new and shiny PHP because they want to use the latest version of Zend. They are proposing using this package [2] but I never heard of this repo.
For me it sound like an example of the difference between "bleeding edge" and "enterprise" systems. The first is what developers most often like, the second is what humble sysadmins prefer as they have to keep something developed long ago running for as long as possible - and without crashed, daemons dying etc (== "bleeding" which always accompanies "bleeding edge" anything). Sorry for venting my own usual pain here...
Add another of that opinion. All the years that I did development, I never needed bleeding edge, and I've done a lot. On the other hand, if the spec said the current version would support something, it *better*, because, sooner or later, I'd find a need to use whatever.
Bleeding edge never supports that NEWSHINY without breaking.... Like the team lead, now years gone, who built a project here in ruby on rails... and was constantly *terrified* when I wanted/needed to update the servers that was on, and stayed on "enterprise version whatever", without current updates.... Things like that are what I refer to as fragile....
mark
El 22/10/2015 a las 12:48 p.m., Valeri Galtsev escribió:
On Thu, October 22, 2015 10:40 am, Jim Perrin wrote:
On 10/22/2015 10:31 AM, Andrew Holway wrote:
Hi,
So, it seems that the current version of PHP in Centos 7 is PHP 5.4.16 however this version of PHP stopped getting security support from the PHP people one month ago [1].
Now, our developers want to use the new and shiny PHP because they want to use the latest version of Zend. They are proposing using this package [2] but I never heard of this repo.
For me it sound like an example of the difference between "bleeding edge" and "enterprise" systems. The first is what developers most often like, the second is what humble sysadmins prefer as they have to keep something developed long ago running for as long as possible - and without crashed, daemons dying etc (== "bleeding" which always accompanies "bleeding edge" anything). Sorry for venting my own usual pain here...
Valeri
PHP 5.4 is in EOL, it get no more security updates from PHP developers... its may be a security risk to use this in in long term. centos should change the php version more ofthen. I dont uderstand centos 6, its still using php 5.3, who got EOL a year ago... I had to switch to another repo to get this (to not get the headache by compile by hand). If you want to change to a log term support, you should use php 5.6, this is under active development now. centos packagers mantainers should listen the PHP developers in this topic, they are the ones who really knows PHP http://php.net/supported-versions.php
Other than building the packages ourselves is there a more acceptable way to run a later version of PHP?
Thoughts? Experiences? Ramblings?
I'm personally not a fan of the webtatic repository. This is mostly due to the number of users on irc who seem to have problems with it. I would recommend either the upcoming software collections packages or the IUS repository packages. https://iuscommunity.org/pages/About.html
IUS has been a very good/reliable way to get more recent versions of things, and the folks responsible for it are active both on irc and in the mailing lists.
-- Jim Perrin The CentOS Project | http://www.centos.org twitter: @BitIntegrity | GPG Key: FA09AD77 _______________________________________________ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org https://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Valeri Galtsev Sr System Administrator Department of Astronomy and Astrophysics Kavli Institute for Cosmological Physics University of Chicago Phone: 773-702-4247 ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ _______________________________________________ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org https://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Juan,
You need to be aware how RHEL distributes software. Please read https://access.redhat.com/security/updates/backporting
It's irrelevant in this case that PHP 5.3 is EOL. It will continue to be supported by Red Hat with security patches.
-- Sent from the Delta quadrant using Borg technology!
Nux! www.nux.ro
----- Original Message -----
From: "Juan Bernhard" juan@inti.gob.ar To: centos@centos.org Sent: Thursday, 22 October, 2015 17:20:02 Subject: Re: [CentOS] PHP version not enough for developers
El 22/10/2015 a las 12:48 p.m., Valeri Galtsev escribió:
On Thu, October 22, 2015 10:40 am, Jim Perrin wrote:
On 10/22/2015 10:31 AM, Andrew Holway wrote:
Hi,
So, it seems that the current version of PHP in Centos 7 is PHP 5.4.16 however this version of PHP stopped getting security support from the PHP people one month ago [1].
Now, our developers want to use the new and shiny PHP because they want to use the latest version of Zend. They are proposing using this package [2] but I never heard of this repo.
For me it sound like an example of the difference between "bleeding edge" and "enterprise" systems. The first is what developers most often like, the second is what humble sysadmins prefer as they have to keep something developed long ago running for as long as possible - and without crashed, daemons dying etc (== "bleeding" which always accompanies "bleeding edge" anything). Sorry for venting my own usual pain here...
Valeri
PHP 5.4 is in EOL, it get no more security updates from PHP developers... its may be a security risk to use this in in long term. centos should change the php version more ofthen. I dont uderstand centos 6, its still using php 5.3, who got EOL a year ago... I had to switch to another repo to get this (to not get the headache by compile by hand). If you want to change to a log term support, you should use php 5.6, this is under active development now. centos packagers mantainers should listen the PHP developers in this topic, they are the ones who really knows PHP http://php.net/supported-versions.php
Other than building the packages ourselves is there a more acceptable way to run a later version of PHP?
Thoughts? Experiences? Ramblings?
I'm personally not a fan of the webtatic repository. This is mostly due to the number of users on irc who seem to have problems with it. I would recommend either the upcoming software collections packages or the IUS repository packages. https://iuscommunity.org/pages/About.html
IUS has been a very good/reliable way to get more recent versions of things, and the folks responsible for it are active both on irc and in the mailing lists.
-- Jim Perrin The CentOS Project | http://www.centos.org twitter: @BitIntegrity | GPG Key: FA09AD77 _______________________________________________ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org https://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Valeri Galtsev Sr System Administrator Department of Astronomy and Astrophysics Kavli Institute for Cosmological Physics University of Chicago Phone: 773-702-4247 ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ _______________________________________________ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org https://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org https://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Nux! wrote on Thu, 22 Oct 2015 17:27:26 +0100 (BST):
It's irrelevant in this case that PHP 5.3 is EOL. It will continue to be supported by Red Hat with security patches.
Exactly. Nevertheless, PHP 5.6 is not "bleeding edge" as someone else said. 5.5 and 5.6 are really state of the art and often necessary to install certain software packages or for some functionality. The packages provided by RH are much too fast outdated or have other problems. It's a reality.
Kai
Kai,
It is a reality, but when you look at the RHEL target audience, it's not exactly hip devs deploying Docker in the cloud. Big corps, banks and the like have a very slow development cycle and long term support is absolutely crucial, software needs to run for years on end without glitches, without interruptions, in a very predictable manner etc.
For the aforementioned devs I think the best answer are the software collections, that or just use a different distribution. It is what it is.
Lucian
-- Sent from the Delta quadrant using Borg technology!
Nux! www.nux.ro
----- Original Message -----
From: "Kai Schaetzl" maillists@conactive.com To: centos@centos.org Sent: Thursday, 22 October, 2015 17:33:33 Subject: Re: [CentOS] PHP version not enough for developers
Nux! wrote on Thu, 22 Oct 2015 17:27:26 +0100 (BST):
It's irrelevant in this case that PHP 5.3 is EOL. It will continue to be supported by Red Hat with security patches.
Exactly. Nevertheless, PHP 5.6 is not "bleeding edge" as someone else said. 5.5 and 5.6 are really state of the art and often necessary to install certain software packages or for some functionality. The packages provided by RH are much too fast outdated or have other problems. It's a reality.
Kai
CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org https://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
El 22/10/2015 a las 01:40 p.m., Nux! escribió:
Kai,
It is a reality, but when you look at the RHEL target audience, it's not exactly hip devs deploying Docker in the cloud. Big corps, banks and the like have a very slow development cycle and long term support is absolutely crucial, software needs to run for years on end without glitches, without interruptions, in a very predictable manner etc.
For the aforementioned devs I think the best answer are the software collections, that or just use a different distribution. It is what it is.
Lucian
Lucian, they also include the newer versions. The case of banks, who need specially PHP version 5.3, are a slim 0.01% of php users, the rest of the mortals, like me, who needs a simple webmail like horde running, have problems because the rest of the world is not developing any more with php 5.3 compatibility in mind
Saludos, Juan
-- Sent from the Delta quadrant using Borg technology!
Nux! www.nux.ro
----- Original Message -----
From: "Kai Schaetzl" maillists@conactive.com To: centos@centos.org Sent: Thursday, 22 October, 2015 17:33:33 Subject: Re: [CentOS] PHP version not enough for developers
Nux! wrote on Thu, 22 Oct 2015 17:27:26 +0100 (BST):
It's irrelevant in this case that PHP 5.3 is EOL. It will continue to be supported by Red Hat with security patches.
Exactly. Nevertheless, PHP 5.6 is not "bleeding edge" as someone else said. 5.5 and 5.6 are really state of the art and often necessary to install certain software packages or for some functionality. The packages provided by RH are much too fast outdated or have other problems. It's a reality.
Kai
CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org https://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org https://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
On 10/22/2015 11:50 AM, Juan Bernhard wrote:
El 22/10/2015 a las 01:40 p.m., Nux! escribió:
Kai,
It is a reality, but when you look at the RHEL target audience, it's not exactly hip devs deploying Docker in the cloud. Big corps, banks and the like have a very slow development cycle and long term support is absolutely crucial, software needs to run for years on end without glitches, without interruptions, in a very predictable manner etc.
For the aforementioned devs I think the best answer are the software collections, that or just use a different distribution. It is what it is.
Lucian
Lucian, they also include the newer versions. The case of banks, who need specially PHP version 5.3, are a slim 0.01% of php users, the rest of the mortals, like me, who needs a simple webmail like horde running, have problems because the rest of the world is not developing any more with php 5.3 compatibility in mind
Saludos, Juan
Correct .. but that is not who RHEL, CentOS, Ubuntu (LTS), or SLES type distros are for. That is what Fedora, OpenSUSE, Ubuntu, Debian, Linux Mint and any other number of "Bleeding Edge" distros are for. If you want latest and greatest .. well, then use latest and greatest. If you want enterprise, then use CentOS.
-- Sent from the Delta quadrant using Borg technology!
Nux! www.nux.ro
----- Original Message -----
From: "Kai Schaetzl" maillists@conactive.com To: centos@centos.org Sent: Thursday, 22 October, 2015 17:33:33 Subject: Re: [CentOS] PHP version not enough for developers
Nux! wrote on Thu, 22 Oct 2015 17:27:26 +0100 (BST):
It's irrelevant in this case that PHP 5.3 is EOL. It will continue to be supported by Red Hat with security patches.
Exactly. Nevertheless, PHP 5.6 is not "bleeding edge" as someone else said. 5.5 and 5.6 are really state of the art and often necessary to install certain software packages or for some functionality. The packages provided by RH are much too fast outdated or have other problems. It's a reality.
Kai
On Thu, October 22, 2015 12:49 pm, Johnny Hughes wrote:
On 10/22/2015 11:50 AM, Juan Bernhard wrote:
El 22/10/2015 a las 01:40 p.m., Nux! escribió:
Kai,
It is a reality, but when you look at the RHEL target audience, it's not exactly hip devs deploying Docker in the cloud. Big corps, banks and the like have a very slow development cycle and long term support is absolutely crucial, software needs to run for years on end without glitches, without interruptions, in a very predictable manner etc.
For the aforementioned devs I think the best answer are the software collections, that or just use a different distribution. It is what it is.
Lucian
Lucian, they also include the newer versions. The case of banks, who need specially PHP version 5.3, are a slim 0.01% of php users, the rest of the mortals, like me, who needs a simple webmail like horde running, have problems because the rest of the world is not developing any more with php 5.3 compatibility in mind
Saludos, Juan
Correct .. but that is not who RHEL, CentOS, Ubuntu (LTS), or SLES type distros are for. That is what Fedora, OpenSUSE, Ubuntu, Debian, Linux Mint and any other number of "Bleeding Edge" distros are for. If you want latest and greatest .. well, then use latest and greatest. If you want enterprise, then use CentOS.
And incidentally these 0.01% (even if the number is true) of Enterprise users pay virtually 100% of RH income (the last is what the brilliant job of individuals at RH is paid for from). Let's not forget they as well as us have families to support.
Valeri
-- Sent from the Delta quadrant using Borg technology!
Nux! www.nux.ro
----- Original Message -----
From: "Kai Schaetzl" maillists@conactive.com To: centos@centos.org Sent: Thursday, 22 October, 2015 17:33:33 Subject: Re: [CentOS] PHP version not enough for developers
Nux! wrote on Thu, 22 Oct 2015 17:27:26 +0100 (BST):
It's irrelevant in this case that PHP 5.3 is EOL. It will continue to be supported by Red Hat with security patches.
Exactly. Nevertheless, PHP 5.6 is not "bleeding edge" as someone else said. 5.5 and 5.6 are really state of the art and often necessary to install certain software packages or for some functionality. The packages provided by RH are much too fast outdated or have other problems. It's a reality.
Kai
CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org https://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Valeri Galtsev Sr System Administrator Department of Astronomy and Astrophysics Kavli Institute for Cosmological Physics University of Chicago Phone: 773-702-4247 ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
El 22/10/2015 a las 03:00 p.m., Valeri Galtsev escribió:
On Thu, October 22, 2015 12:49 pm, Johnny Hughes wrote:
On 10/22/2015 11:50 AM, Juan Bernhard wrote:
El 22/10/2015 a las 01:40 p.m., Nux! escribió:
Kai,
It is a reality, but when you look at the RHEL target audience, it's not exactly hip devs deploying Docker in the cloud. Big corps, banks and the like have a very slow development cycle and long term support is absolutely crucial, software needs to run for years on end without glitches, without interruptions, in a very predictable manner etc.
For the aforementioned devs I think the best answer are the software collections, that or just use a different distribution. It is what it is.
Lucian
Lucian, they also include the newer versions. The case of banks, who need specially PHP version 5.3, are a slim 0.01% of php users, the rest of the mortals, like me, who needs a simple webmail like horde running, have problems because the rest of the world is not developing any more with php 5.3 compatibility in mind
Saludos, Juan
Correct .. but that is not who RHEL, CentOS, Ubuntu (LTS), or SLES type distros are for. That is what Fedora, OpenSUSE, Ubuntu, Debian, Linux Mint and any other number of "Bleeding Edge" distros are for. If you want latest and greatest .. well, then use latest and greatest. If you want enterprise, then use CentOS.
And incidentally these 0.01% (even if the number is true) of Enterprise users pay virtually 100% of RH income (the last is what the brilliant job of individuals at RH is paid for from). Let's not forget they as well as us have families to support.
Valeri
Im not saying that they must remove this package, but they also should include the newer version. I use freebsd (and its not a toy distro like fedora), and you have several ports, php, php54, php55 and php56 to choose whatever you need. Please, dont think that I dont appreciate the RH job on this, some one should support a long term version, some applications needs this, but very few. Thats all. I needed to say this, this is the only thing that bother me of centos, and its a little thing. The solution is to add another repo, but is a petty that they dont include the newer version on the default one. Centos its a great distro, dont take this a complain... its just a suggestion.
Saludos, Juan
-- Sent from the Delta quadrant using Borg technology!
Nux! www.nux.ro
----- Original Message -----
From: "Kai Schaetzl" maillists@conactive.com To: centos@centos.org Sent: Thursday, 22 October, 2015 17:33:33 Subject: Re: [CentOS] PHP version not enough for developers
Nux! wrote on Thu, 22 Oct 2015 17:27:26 +0100 (BST):
It's irrelevant in this case that PHP 5.3 is EOL. It will continue to be supported by Red Hat with security patches.
Exactly. Nevertheless, PHP 5.6 is not "bleeding edge" as someone else said. 5.5 and 5.6 are really state of the art and often necessary to install certain software packages or for some functionality. The packages provided by RH are much too fast outdated or have other problems. It's a reality.
Kai
CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org https://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Valeri Galtsev Sr System Administrator Department of Astronomy and Astrophysics Kavli Institute for Cosmological Physics University of Chicago Phone: 773-702-4247 ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ _______________________________________________ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org https://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
On 10/22/2015 03:40 PM, Juan Bernhard wrote:
El 22/10/2015 a las 03:00 p.m., Valeri Galtsev escribió:
On Thu, October 22, 2015 12:49 pm, Johnny Hughes wrote:
On 10/22/2015 11:50 AM, Juan Bernhard wrote:
El 22/10/2015 a las 01:40 p.m., Nux! escribió:
Kai,
It is a reality, but when you look at the RHEL target audience, it's not exactly hip devs deploying Docker in the cloud. Big corps, banks and the like have a very slow development cycle and long term support is absolutely crucial, software needs to run for years on end without glitches, without interruptions, in a very predictable manner etc.
For the aforementioned devs I think the best answer are the software collections, that or just use a different distribution. It is what it is.
Lucian
Lucian, they also include the newer versions. The case of banks, who need specially PHP version 5.3, are a slim 0.01% of php users, the rest of the mortals, like me, who needs a simple webmail like horde running, have problems because the rest of the world is not developing any more with php 5.3 compatibility in mind
Saludos, Juan
Correct .. but that is not who RHEL, CentOS, Ubuntu (LTS), or SLES type distros are for. That is what Fedora, OpenSUSE, Ubuntu, Debian, Linux Mint and any other number of "Bleeding Edge" distros are for. If you want latest and greatest .. well, then use latest and greatest. If you want enterprise, then use CentOS.
And incidentally these 0.01% (even if the number is true) of Enterprise users pay virtually 100% of RH income (the last is what the brilliant job of individuals at RH is paid for from). Let's not forget they as well as us have families to support.
Valeri
Im not saying that they must remove this package, but they also should include the newer version. I use freebsd (and its not a toy distro like fedora), and you have several ports, php, php54, php55 and php56 to choose whatever you need. Please, dont think that I dont appreciate the RH job on this, some one should support a long term version, some applications needs this, but very few. Thats all. I needed to say this, this is the only thing that bother me of centos, and its a little thing. The solution is to add another repo, but is a petty that they dont include the newer version on the default one. Centos its a great distro, dont take this a complain... its just a suggestion.
Saludos, Juan
Like I said before .. software collections:
On Thu, October 22, 2015 3:45 pm, Johnny Hughes wrote:
On 10/22/2015 03:40 PM, Juan Bernhard wrote:
El 22/10/2015 a las 03:00 p.m., Valeri Galtsev escribió:
On Thu, October 22, 2015 12:49 pm, Johnny Hughes wrote:
On 10/22/2015 11:50 AM, Juan Bernhard wrote:
El 22/10/2015 a las 01:40 p.m., Nux! escribió:
Kai,
It is a reality, but when you look at the RHEL target audience, it's not exactly hip devs deploying Docker in the cloud. Big corps, banks and the like have a very slow development cycle and long term support is absolutely crucial, software needs to run for years on end without glitches, without interruptions, in a very predictable manner etc.
For the aforementioned devs I think the best answer are the software collections, that or just use a different distribution. It is what it is.
Lucian
Lucian, they also include the newer versions. The case of banks, who need specially PHP version 5.3, are a slim 0.01% of php users, the rest of the mortals, like me, who needs a simple webmail like horde running, have problems because the rest of the world is not developing any more with php 5.3 compatibility in mind
Saludos, Juan
Correct .. but that is not who RHEL, CentOS, Ubuntu (LTS), or SLES type distros are for. That is what Fedora, OpenSUSE, Ubuntu, Debian, Linux Mint and any other number of "Bleeding Edge" distros are for. If you want latest and greatest .. well, then use latest and greatest. If you want enterprise, then use CentOS.
And incidentally these 0.01% (even if the number is true) of Enterprise users pay virtually 100% of RH income (the last is what the brilliant job of individuals at RH is paid for from). Let's not forget they as well as us have families to support.
Valeri
Im not saying that they must remove this package, but they also should include the newer version. I use freebsd (and its not a toy distro like fedora), and you have several ports, php, php54, php55 and php56 to choose whatever you need. Please, dont think that I dont appreciate the RH job on this, some one should support a long term version, some applications needs this, but very few. Thats all. I needed to say this, this is the only thing that bother me of centos, and its a little thing. The solution is to add another repo, but is a petty that they dont include the newer version on the default one. Centos its a great distro, dont take this a complain... its just a suggestion.
Saludos, Juan
Like I said before .. software collections:
I would add to software collections you mention and different Linux distributions (differing in update/upgrade lifecycle scheme) also other *nix-es, FreeBSD was one someone mentioned already (I too "half-moved" servers to it), but there are many other choices of systems. Still, disregarding the part some of us dislike personally (plus often reboots necessary to install some vital updates - which all Linuxes are prone to beginning somewhere around 2.6 kernel) I would say I really admire the great job RH folks are doing - and definitely tremendous job CentOS maintainers do!
Just my 0.02
Valeri
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Valeri Galtsev Sr System Administrator Department of Astronomy and Astrophysics Kavli Institute for Cosmological Physics University of Chicago Phone: 773-702-4247 ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
On 10/22/2015 1:40 PM, Juan Bernhard wrote:
Im not saying that they must remove this package, but they also should include the newer version. I use freebsd (and its not a toy distro like fedora), and you have several ports, php, php54, php55 and php56 to choose whatever you need. Please, dont think that I dont appreciate the RH job on this, some one should support a long term version, some applications needs this, but very few. Thats all. I needed to say this, this is the only thing that bother me of centos, and its a little thing. The solution is to add another repo, but is a petty that they dont include the newer version on the default one. Centos its a great distro, dont take this a complain... its just a suggestion.
that suggestion would have to be made with RH, not CentOS, as the default CentOS package list *IS* the RHEL package list.
On Thu, October 22, 2015 11:20 am, Juan Bernhard wrote:
El 22/10/2015 a las 12:48 p.m., Valeri Galtsev escribió:
On Thu, October 22, 2015 10:40 am, Jim Perrin wrote:
On 10/22/2015 10:31 AM, Andrew Holway wrote:
Hi, So, it seems that the current version of PHP in Centos 7 is PHP
5.4.16
however this version of PHP stopped getting security support from the
PHP
people one month ago [1]. Now, our developers want to use the new and shiny PHP because they want to use the latest version of Zend. They are proposing using this package
[2]
but I never heard of this repo.
For me it sound like an example of the difference between "bleeding edge" and "enterprise" systems. The first is what developers most often like,
the second is what humble sysadmins prefer as they have to keep something
developed long ago running for as long as possible - and without crashed, daemons dying etc (== "bleeding" which always accompanies "bleeding edge" anything). Sorry for venting my own usual pain here... Valeri
PHP 5.4 is in EOL, it get no more security updates from PHP developers... its may be a security risk to use this in in long term.
centos should change the php version more ofthen. I dont uderstand centos 6, its still using php 5.3, who got EOL a year ago... I had to switch to another repo to get this (to not get the headache by compile by hand).
If you want to change to a log term support, you should use php 5.6,
this is under active development now.
centos packagers mantainers should listen the PHP developers in this
topic, they are the ones who really knows PHP
This yet once more exemplifies the point I was trying to make. If I build new system (with new components of end point software using, say PHP), then I would pick the latest stable version of PHP. Exactly as you are point out. And I prefer to roll new box out with all latest stable everything. From this point on, once I have the box in production, I often have no luxury (when time goes by) to upgrade some components other stuff needs to run with. Like PHP that will be latest stable 3 years down the road will be several minor versions up, and some of my end components may not run with it as some internals may have changed. At this point it is exactly what I am trying to stress: either I break things that I have no newer version that works with latest version of PHP, or I can stay with older version of PHP - if at all possible. This is basically the difference between, say, Debian (and clones) style of updates/upgrades (when update bring you new version of package) and RH Enterprise Linux which keeps older version (thus preserving all internals), and [doing tremendous job of] backporting security and bug fixes implemented in new version to older version. At least this is what we loved about RHEL - not quite sure to what extent it still is true recently.
The best example of really troublesome compatibility would be python and modules for it. To my python developers and users I call python a "sneaky snake". Whoever worked with python and modules written for it knows what I talk about: you always beed to match versions of modules rather rigorously the version of python itself, or things will not work. There is, however excellent "Enterprise" piece of software written in python: mailman. I really never had any trouble of any kind with mailman. This is what I figure Mark meant when he said you can write software which will work with big range of different versions of whatever it depends on - he is (was?) developer, he knows what he is talking about.
Valeri
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Valeri Galtsev Sr System Administrator Department of Astronomy and Astrophysics Kavli Institute for Cosmological Physics University of Chicago Phone: 773-702-4247 ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
On Thu, Oct 22, 2015 at 01:20:02PM -0300, Juan Bernhard wrote:
If you want to change to a log term support, you should use php 5.6, this is under active development now. centos packagers mantainers should listen the PHP developers in this topic, they are the ones who really knows PHP
But you don't seem to understand CentOS.
The packages in the main repo aren't maintained by 'centos package maintainers'. They are rebuilt from RHEL source packages. If you've got a complaint with the version, complain to Red Hat. As other have explained in this thread, you should expect considerably longer support from Red Hat (and thus CentOS) for any release of PHP than you'll get from upstream PHP.
Sure, if you don't care about having a product continue working after a couple years, go ahead and build the upstream version of PHP and manually apply security updates yourself. Maybe you can pay the PHP developers to support it for you, since they really seem to know PHP.
If you want to have a stable platform to deploy your web service, use an enterprise operating system like CentOS.
I've been using IUS in the past. They have a good way of naming their rpms, so they don't interfere with the RH rpms. But they don't support older CentOS versions still on extended support as long as I needed them. And they don't provide as much php-related rpms (f.i. pecl-stuff) as remi does. So, with newer PHP versions I had to go to remi's repo. Combined with EPEL (and rpmforge being dead, anyway) it's working quite fine here for PHP 5.5 and 5.6. He provides files for CentOS 5, 6 and 7. The only caveat is that he uses the same rpm names as with the original ones. So, you have to give this repo the same priority as the base repo has. In consequence you have to be careful what it wants to install as dependencies and exclude a package sometimes. But all in all it works very well.
I've used the webtatic repo once for a special case. I don't know exactly why but I wouldn't recommend it.
If IUS provides the version you need I'd go with that.
Kai
On 10/22/2015 10:31 AM, Andrew Holway wrote:
Hi,
So, it seems that the current version of PHP in Centos 7 is PHP 5.4.16 however this version of PHP stopped getting security support from the PHP people one month ago [1].
Now, our developers want to use the new and shiny PHP because they want to use the latest version of Zend. They are proposing using this package [2] but I never heard of this repo.
Other than building the packages ourselves is there a more acceptable way to run a later version of PHP?
Thoughts? Experiences? Ramblings?
I would point out that Red Hat backports items to RHEL-7 (and we therefore backport those into CentOS-7 when we rebuild the source code).
I would also point out that the developers who ignore RHEL then ignore getting their code into enterprises that use RHEL. Being that those enterprises are the people PAYING for Linux, it MIGHT be the brightest idea for those developers to write code that they expect to be paid for for non-enterprise distributions :)
That said, software collections is one way to get newer development tools and we should have more software collections, including a newer version of php, very soon in CentOS-7.
The collections will go here when ready:
http://mirror.centos.org/centos/7/sclo/
Right now only a couple of things there. Will be more soon.
On 10/22/2015 12:40 PM, Johnny Hughes wrote:
On 10/22/2015 10:31 AM, Andrew Holway wrote:
Hi,
So, it seems that the current version of PHP in Centos 7 is PHP 5.4.16 however this version of PHP stopped getting security support from the PHP people one month ago [1].
Now, our developers want to use the new and shiny PHP because they want to use the latest version of Zend. They are proposing using this package [2] but I never heard of this repo.
Other than building the packages ourselves is there a more acceptable way to run a later version of PHP?
Thoughts? Experiences? Ramblings?
I would point out that Red Hat backports items to RHEL-7 (and we therefore backport those into CentOS-7 when we rebuild the source code).
I would also point out that the developers who ignore RHEL then ignore getting their code into enterprises that use RHEL. Being that those enterprises are the people PAYING for Linux, it MIGHT be the brightest idea for those developers to write code that they expect to be paid for for non-enterprise distributions :)
That said, software collections is one way to get newer development tools and we should have more software collections, including a newer version of php, very soon in CentOS-7.
The collections will go here when ready:
http://mirror.centos.org/centos/7/sclo/
Right now only a couple of things there. Will be more soon.
Here is a very, very early version to look at:
http://cbs.centos.org/repos/sclo7-php55-rh-candidate/x86_64/os/
That is not ready for production, but an idea of what will be available.
-
Andrew Holway -
Jim Perrin -
John R Pierce -
Johnny Hughes -
Jonathan Billings -
Juan Bernhard -
Kai Schaetzl -
m.roth＠5-cent.us -
Nux! -
Valeri Galtsev