All,
Here is a request for Zimbra to provide official CentOS support: http://bugzilla.zimbra.com/show_bug.cgi?id=23487
Here is a poll that might help them see how many CentOS Customers they REALLY have: http://www.zimbra.com/forums/users/14136-foss-edition-most-popular-linux-dis...
I am not asking for anyone to do anything mean, or to say anything untrue, in fact, please don't.
I am asking that if you use Zimbra on CentOS (either the Free Version or the Network Version) that you let them know that you are. If you would pay for Official support, let them know that too.
Thanks, Johnny Hughes
On Wed, 2008-01-09 at 11:14 -0600, Johnny Hughes wrote:
All,
Here is a request for Zimbra to provide official CentOS support: http://bugzilla.zimbra.com/show_bug.cgi?id=23487
Here is a poll that might help them see how many CentOS Customers they REALLY have: http://www.zimbra.com/forums/users/14136-foss-edition-most-popular-linux-dis...
I am not asking for anyone to do anything mean, or to say anything untrue, in fact, please don't.
I am asking that if you use Zimbra on CentOS (either the Free Version or the Network Version) that you let them know that you are. If you would pay for Official support, let them know that too.
---- it wouldn't seem that Zimbra's position (they don't support CentOS) is any different than a lot of other software out there.
I can see the reason that you would take it personally but they don't mean it personally, it's just typical of another proprietary software company shirking responsibility...no more, no less.
They surely could support CentOS and it's obvious after a bit of inspection that the problem that they are experiencing is not just CentOS but also RHEL. I think what this really says is that CentOS is really popular and the issues were more obvious on CentOS because of the number of people using Zimbra with CentOS. I think you may see an alarming trend to this...where companies are seeing more problems with CentOS than RHEL simply because there are more people using CentOS...I wonder.
Craig
Craig White wrote:
On Wed, 2008-01-09 at 11:14 -0600, Johnny Hughes wrote:
All,
Here is a request for Zimbra to provide official CentOS support: http://bugzilla.zimbra.com/show_bug.cgi?id=23487
Here is a poll that might help them see how many CentOS Customers they REALLY have: http://www.zimbra.com/forums/users/14136-foss-edition-most-popular-linux-dis...
I am not asking for anyone to do anything mean, or to say anything untrue, in fact, please don't.
I am asking that if you use Zimbra on CentOS (either the Free Version or the Network Version) that you let them know that you are. If you would pay for Official support, let them know that too.
it wouldn't seem that Zimbra's position (they don't support CentOS) is any different than a lot of other software out there.
I can see the reason that you would take it personally but they don't mean it personally, it's just typical of another proprietary software company shirking responsibility...no more, no less.
They surely could support CentOS and it's obvious after a bit of inspection that the problem that they are experiencing is not just CentOS but also RHEL. I think what this really says is that CentOS is really popular and the issues were more obvious on CentOS because of the number of people using Zimbra with CentOS. I think you may see an alarming trend to this...where companies are seeing more problems with CentOS than RHEL simply because there are more people using CentOS...I wonder.
Sure, I agree.
What I took personally was the suggestion to use Ubuntu instead of CentOS ... and the fact that they support many other distros with their FOSS version and still do not even support CentOS there.
http://www.zimbra.com/forums/announcements/14116-centos-not-supported.html
That has been corrected as it was not a CentOS problem:
http://www.zimbra.com/forums/announcements/14213-our-centos-users.html
All the while, several of their developers RUN CentOS and Zimbra for their MTA. There are even many development CentOS servers in their organization and they will not even support it in the FOSS edit???
Besides, I am quite tired of people supporting CentOS under the table. If they are going to support it, they need to do so openly.
I did not open that bug, nor did I decide that Ubuntu was a better server option to support than CentOS. But since the bug is open, CentOS users of Zimbra should, in my opinion, respond.
I do think that CentOS users who use Zimbra should take this opportunity to let Zimbra know how many of them there are and ask to not be the red-headed step child any longer.
Bug to ask for support: http://bugzilla.zimbra.com/show_bug.cgi?id=23487
Poll to tell them if you use CentOS: http://www.zimbra.com/forums/users/14136-foss-edition-most-popular-linux-dis...
Thanks, Johnny Hughes
On Thu, 2008-01-10 at 09:02 -0600, Johnny Hughes wrote:
Craig White wrote:
On Wed, 2008-01-09 at 11:14 -0600, Johnny Hughes wrote:
All,
Here is a request for Zimbra to provide official CentOS support: http://bugzilla.zimbra.com/show_bug.cgi?id=23487
Here is a poll that might help them see how many CentOS Customers they REALLY have: http://www.zimbra.com/forums/users/14136-foss-edition-most-popular-linux-dis...
I am not asking for anyone to do anything mean, or to say anything untrue, in fact, please don't.
I am asking that if you use Zimbra on CentOS (either the Free Version or the Network Version) that you let them know that you are. If you would pay for Official support, let them know that too.
it wouldn't seem that Zimbra's position (they don't support CentOS) is any different than a lot of other software out there.
I can see the reason that you would take it personally but they don't mean it personally, it's just typical of another proprietary software company shirking responsibility...no more, no less.
They surely could support CentOS and it's obvious after a bit of inspection that the problem that they are experiencing is not just CentOS but also RHEL. I think what this really says is that CentOS is really popular and the issues were more obvious on CentOS because of the number of people using Zimbra with CentOS. I think you may see an alarming trend to this...where companies are seeing more problems with CentOS than RHEL simply because there are more people using CentOS...I wonder.
Sure, I agree.
What I took personally was the suggestion to use Ubuntu instead of CentOS ... and the fact that they support many other distros with their FOSS version and still do not even support CentOS there.
http://www.zimbra.com/forums/announcements/14116-centos-not-supported.html
That has been corrected as it was not a CentOS problem:
http://www.zimbra.com/forums/announcements/14213-our-centos-users.html
All the while, several of their developers RUN CentOS and Zimbra for their MTA. There are even many development CentOS servers in their organization and they will not even support it in the FOSS edit???
Besides, I am quite tired of people supporting CentOS under the table. If they are going to support it, they need to do so openly.
I did not open that bug, nor did I decide that Ubuntu was a better server option to support than CentOS. But since the bug is open, CentOS users of Zimbra should, in my opinion, respond.
I do think that CentOS users who use Zimbra should take this opportunity to let Zimbra know how many of them there are and ask to not be the red-headed step child any longer.
---- The import seems to be unspoken but it bespeaks of a company that seeks to disown issues and blame their customers rather than solve the problems.
Craig
Craig White wrote:
On Thu, 2008-01-10 at 09:02 -0600, Johnny Hughes wrote:
Craig White wrote:
On Wed, 2008-01-09 at 11:14 -0600, Johnny Hughes wrote:
All,
Here is a request for Zimbra to provide official CentOS support: http://bugzilla.zimbra.com/show_bug.cgi?id=23487
Here is a poll that might help them see how many CentOS Customers they REALLY have: http://www.zimbra.com/forums/users/14136-foss-edition-most-popular-linux-dis...
I am not asking for anyone to do anything mean, or to say anything untrue, in fact, please don't.
I am asking that if you use Zimbra on CentOS (either the Free Version or the Network Version) that you let them know that you are. If you would pay for Official support, let them know that too.
it wouldn't seem that Zimbra's position (they don't support CentOS) is any different than a lot of other software out there.
I can see the reason that you would take it personally but they don't mean it personally, it's just typical of another proprietary software company shirking responsibility...no more, no less.
They surely could support CentOS and it's obvious after a bit of inspection that the problem that they are experiencing is not just CentOS but also RHEL. I think what this really says is that CentOS is really popular and the issues were more obvious on CentOS because of the number of people using Zimbra with CentOS. I think you may see an alarming trend to this...where companies are seeing more problems with CentOS than RHEL simply because there are more people using CentOS...I wonder.
Sure, I agree.
What I took personally was the suggestion to use Ubuntu instead of CentOS ... and the fact that they support many other distros with their FOSS version and still do not even support CentOS there.
http://www.zimbra.com/forums/announcements/14116-centos-not-supported.html
That has been corrected as it was not a CentOS problem:
http://www.zimbra.com/forums/announcements/14213-our-centos-users.html
All the while, several of their developers RUN CentOS and Zimbra for their MTA. There are even many development CentOS servers in their organization and they will not even support it in the FOSS edit???
Besides, I am quite tired of people supporting CentOS under the table. If they are going to support it, they need to do so openly.
I did not open that bug, nor did I decide that Ubuntu was a better server option to support than CentOS. But since the bug is open, CentOS users of Zimbra should, in my opinion, respond.
I do think that CentOS users who use Zimbra should take this opportunity to let Zimbra know how many of them there are and ask to not be the red-headed step child any longer.
The import seems to be unspoken but it bespeaks of a company that seeks to disown issues and blame their customers rather than solve the problems.
It would seem not all Mail server companies feel this way, Scalix for example :-)
http://www.itjungle.com/bns/bns010808-story01.html
Thanks, Johnny Hughes
On Wed, 09 Jan 2008 20:12:18 -0700 Craig White craigwhite@azapple.com wrote:
I can see the reason that you would take it personally but they don't mean it personally, it's just typical of another proprietary software company shirking responsibility...no more, no less.
What do you mean shirking responsibility? They are a company that employs people and is in business to earn a living. Now, they are enquiring if people using CentOS are willing to pay for their support?
They use some open source software and have given back plenty to the community, including an open source version. What else do you want?
On Thu, 2008-01-10 at 09:42 -0800, centos@911networks.com wrote:
On Wed, 09 Jan 2008 20:12:18 -0700 Craig White craigwhite@azapple.com wrote:
I can see the reason that you would take it personally but they don't mean it personally, it's just typical of another proprietary software company shirking responsibility...no more, no less.
What do you mean shirking responsibility? They are a company that employs people and is in business to earn a living. Now, they are enquiring if people using CentOS are willing to pay for their support?
They use some open source software and have given back plenty to the community, including an open source version. What else do you want?
---- probably a company that investigates the problem rather than telling its users to switch to Ubuntu.
Craig
Craig White wrote:
On Wed, 2008-01-09 at 11:14 -0600, Johnny Hughes wrote:
All,
Here is a request for Zimbra to provide official CentOS support: http://bugzilla.zimbra.com/show_bug.cgi?id=23487
Here is a poll that might help them see how many CentOS Customers they REALLY have: http://www.zimbra.com/forums/users/14136-foss-edition-most-popular-linux-dis...
I am not asking for anyone to do anything mean, or to say anything untrue, in fact, please don't.
I am asking that if you use Zimbra on CentOS (either the Free Version or the Network Version) that you let them know that you are. If you would pay for Official support, let them know that too.
it wouldn't seem that Zimbra's position (they don't support CentOS) is any different than a lot of other software out there.
I can see the reason that you would take it personally but they don't mean it personally, it's just typical of another proprietary software company shirking responsibility...no more, no less.
They surely could support CentOS and it's obvious after a bit of inspection that the problem that they are experiencing is not just CentOS but also RHEL. I think what this really says is that CentOS is really popular and the issues were more obvious on CentOS because of the number of people using Zimbra with CentOS. I think you may see an alarming trend to this...where companies are seeing more problems with CentOS than RHEL simply because there are more people using CentOS...I wonder.
Craig
Or more people are choosing for CentOS instead of RHEL..
No offence, but in my opinion, RHEL really does not add enough value for the money they are asking.
To get back on topic; I am using Zimbra on C5.1.. Or at least, I want to, but I experience some critical bugs (not CentOS specific).
Cheers,
Bart
On Wed, 2008-01-09 at 11:14 -0600, Johnny Hughes wrote:
I am not asking for anyone to do anything mean, or to say anything untrue, in fact, please don't.
I am asking that if you use Zimbra on CentOS (either the Free Version or the Network Version) that you let them know that you are. If you would pay for Official support, let them know that too.
I'm thinking about deploying Zimbra for a customer, and perhaps even for myself. But, I haven't figured out if I want to use Zimbra or Scalix. I haven't spent much time investigating, though.
Ranbir
I've never looked at scalix, but I have installed zimbra on a test system.
Unfortunately, I had to install from a tarball, which I really don't like.
Instead of determining if you have the existing products (apache, clamav, slapd, tomcat, etc) and then configuring them, zimbra (the tarball) installs everything in /opt and I think it kills existing running apps. So if you were running a web server before you installed the tarball, you'd have to integrate your stuff with zimbra.
Kanwar Ranbir Sandhu wrote:
On Wed, 2008-01-09 at 11:14 -0600, Johnny Hughes wrote:
I am not asking for anyone to do anything mean, or to say anything untrue, in fact, please don't.
I am asking that if you use Zimbra on CentOS (either the Free Version or the Network Version) that you let them know that you are. If you would pay for Official support, let them know that too.
I'm thinking about deploying Zimbra for a customer, and perhaps even for myself. But, I haven't figured out if I want to use Zimbra or Scalix. I haven't spent much time investigating, though.
Ranbir
----- "Milton Calnek" milton@calnek.com wrote:
I've never looked at scalix, but I have installed zimbra on a test system.
Unfortunately, I had to install from a tarball, which I really don't like.
Instead of determining if you have the existing products (apache, clamav, slapd, tomcat, etc) and then configuring them, zimbra (the tarball) installs everything in /opt and I think it kills existing running apps. So if you were running a web server before you installed the tarball, you'd have to integrate your stuff with zimbra.
Kanwar Ranbir Sandhu wrote:
On Wed, 2008-01-09 at 11:14 -0600, Johnny Hughes wrote:
I am not asking for anyone to do anything mean, or to say anything untrue, in fact, please don't.
I am asking that if you use Zimbra on CentOS (either the Free
Version or
the Network Version) that you let them know that you are. If you
would
pay for Official support, let them know that too.
I'm thinking about deploying Zimbra for a customer, and perhaps even
for
myself. But, I haven't figured out if I want to use Zimbra or
Scalix.
I haven't spent much time investigating, though.
Ranbir
-- Milton Calnek BSc, A/Slt(Ret.) milton@calnek.com 306-717-8737
-- This message has been scanned for viruses and dangerous content by MailScanner, and is believed to be clean.
CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
-- This message has been scanned for viruses and dangerous content by MailScanner, and is believed to be clean.
Why did you have to install from a tarball ? Were you not running an RPM based distro ? Even so, they have the following distros officially supported;
5.0.1 GA Release
* Red Hat Enterprise Linux 5 x86 HTTP | Bittorrent * Red Hat Enterprise Linux 5 x86_64 HTTP | Bittorrent * Red Hat Enterprise Linux 4 x86 HTTP | Bittorrent * Red Hat Enterprise Linux 4 x86_64 HTTP | Bittorrent * Red Hat Fedora 7 x86 HTTP | Bittorrent * Debian 4 x86 HTTP | Bittorrent * MacOS X x86 HTTP | Bittorrent * openSUSE Linux 10.2 x86 HTTP | Bittorrent * SUSE Linux Enterprise Server 10 x86 HTTP | Bittorrent * SUSE Linux Enterprise Server 10 x86_64 HTTP | Bittorrent * Ubuntu 6.06 LTS x86 HTTP | Bittorrent
And each one comes in the right package format, .deb .rpm etc etc. And it is simply a case of running 'install.sh' and it takes care of the rest.
Also, I actually like the fact that it wants its own machine to run in. Makes it more 'applicance' like and believe me it makes for much easier administration. In my case, zimbra server runs in a xen based VM, so there is no real issue with having to integrate other things with zimbra.
I also tried scalix a while back, but IMO, it was not as feature rich as zimbra and it felt a bit clunkier. Now that I'm using zimbra I don't think I'd even bother to look at scalix for at least a couple of years. YMMV.
Look at their website (http://www.scalix.com/community/communityedition/index.php) , they state;
==================================================================================
System Requirements Operating Systems Supported Red Hat Enterprise Linux 4.0 or 5.0 SUSE Linux Enterprise Server 9.0 or 10.0 Fedora 7*, CentOS 4*, 5* SUSE Linux Open Source Software (OSS) 10.1* RAM 1GB Disk Space 200 MB for base installation> + Space for user mailboxes + Space for client caches equivalent to 15% of data being indexed + 30% additional for LVM snapshot In-Place Upgrades
If you’ve deployed Community Edition on a currently supported platform, when you’re ready to upgrade, your upgrade experience will be seamless. Upgrading Community Edition on a supported platform to Small Business Edition or Enterprise Edition involves an in-place, license key-only upgrade that can be performed without any user disruption – even while users are logged in and active. Download Now
Download Scalix Community Edition now and experience for yourself our feature-rich, commercial-grade email and calendaring solution.
*These distributions are not recommended for production because of the frequency of upgrades.
==================================================================================
Notice the '*' next to centos 4 and 5 and then the footnote ? Obviously they are sadly mistaken, 'cause as we all know they are almost identical to the Redhat EL 4 and 5 and therefore have almost identical frequency of updates.
Who should set the record straight for them ? Someone with an email address that ends @centos.org no doubt.
On Thursday 17 January 2008, redhat@mckerrs.net wrote:
Notice the '*' next to centos 4 and 5 and then the footnote ? Obviously they are sadly mistaken, 'cause as we all know they are almost identical to the Redhat EL 4 and 5 and therefore have almost identical frequency of updates.
They already know; read the forum thread http://www.scalix.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=9394&postdays=0&postord...
In particular, on page 2 of that thread, the Scalix guy Florian says this: "We've started community/evaluation support for CentOS4/5 for 11.3, so that those Fedora users don't have to complain about having to upgrade their operating system with every Scalix upgrade. We'll fully support this for commercial use in the next version. "
In other words, as of Scalix 11.4, the next version, CentOS 4 and 5 will be fully supported in production, and 11.3 is supported for eval/community now (no more tweak needed to get it to install).
For 'supported' in this context, this means that Scalix will provide real commercial support if you use CentOS 4 or 5; you have, with a little tweak, been able to use Scalix on CentOS 4 and 5 for a long time; I've been using Scalix on CentOS 4 for quite a while now. It's just not 'officially supported' for production by scalix.
redhat@mckerrs.net wrote:
----- "Milton Calnek" milton@calnek.com wrote:
I've never looked at scalix, but I have installed zimbra on a test system.
Unfortunately, I had to install from a tarball, which I really don't like.
Instead of determining if you have the existing products (apache, clamav, slapd, tomcat, etc) and then configuring them, zimbra (the tarball) installs everything in /opt and I think it kills existing running apps. So if you were running a web server before you installed the tarball, you'd have to integrate your stuff with zimbra.
Kanwar Ranbir Sandhu wrote:
On Wed, 2008-01-09 at 11:14 -0600, Johnny Hughes wrote:
I am not asking for anyone to do anything mean, or to say anything untrue, in fact, please don't.
I am asking that if you use Zimbra on CentOS (either the Free
Version or
the Network Version) that you let them know that you are. If you
would
pay for Official support, let them know that too.
I'm thinking about deploying Zimbra for a customer, and perhaps even
for
myself. But, I haven't figured out if I want to use Zimbra or
Scalix.
I haven't spent much time investigating, though.
Ranbir
-- Milton Calnek BSc, A/Slt(Ret.) milton@calnek.com 306-717-8737
-- This message has been scanned for viruses and dangerous content by MailScanner, and is believed to be clean.
CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
-- This message has been scanned for viruses and dangerous content by MailScanner, and is believed to be clean.
Why did you have to install from a tarball ? Were you not running an RPM based distro ? Even so, they have the following distros officially supported;
5.0.1 GA Release
* Red Hat Enterprise Linux 5 x86 HTTP | Bittorrent * Red Hat Enterprise Linux 5 x86_64 HTTP | Bittorrent * Red Hat Enterprise Linux 4 x86 HTTP | Bittorrent * Red Hat Enterprise Linux 4 x86_64 HTTP | Bittorrent * Red Hat Fedora 7 x86 HTTP | Bittorrent * Debian 4 x86 HTTP | Bittorrent * MacOS X x86 HTTP | Bittorrent * openSUSE Linux 10.2 x86 HTTP | Bittorrent * SUSE Linux Enterprise Server 10 x86 HTTP | Bittorrent * SUSE Linux Enterprise Server 10 x86_64 HTTP | Bittorrent * Ubuntu 6.06 LTS x86 HTTP | BittorrentAnd each one comes in the right package format, .deb .rpm etc etc. And it is simply a case of running 'install.sh' and it takes care of the rest.
Also, I actually like the fact that it wants its own machine to run in. Makes it more 'applicance' like and believe me it makes for much easier administration. In my case, zimbra server runs in a xen based VM, so there is no real issue with having to integrate other things with zimbra.
I also tried scalix a while back, but IMO, it was not as feature rich as zimbra and it felt a bit clunkier. Now that I'm using zimbra I don't think I'd even bother to look at scalix for at least a couple of years. YMMV.
I remember trying to install the RPM, but it didn't work. I don't remember any details other than in order to get it working, I had to use the tarball. Which btw goes against my Generally Acceptable Administrative Practices.
I might blow it away and install the rpm version... but probably not before I setup a virtual machine to put it on.
-
Centos -
centos＠911networks.com -
Craig White -
Craig White -
Johnny Hughes -
Kanwar Ranbir Sandhu -
Lamar Owen -
Milton Calnek -
redhat＠mckerrs.net