A bit off-topic. Not a question on how to get it working, but rather question about an practical issue after you get it to work ;-)
I got a DVD burner that supports DVD-RAM (in addition to standard DVD+R/-R). I really liked "use it just like hard disk" properties of DVD-RAM, and according to some sources I found, the media itself is more resistant to ageing than standard DVD+R/-R. Great for archiving my data. But the media seems to be quite expensive. I guess mostly because all the places I found were selling it in most expensive option: as single disc in a nice (and useless) case. Haven't found a single place that sells them on spindle. At the end, I ended up buying a 3-pack, with each media in bulky movie-type case (what a waste of space).
Does anybody know of any place that sells DVD-RAM media cheap (in bulk, on spindle)?
Thanks, Aleksandar Milivojevic
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On Fri, 2005-08-05 at 09:39 -0500, Aleksandar Milivojevic wrote:
A bit off-topic. Not a question on how to get it working, but rather question about an practical issue after you get it to work ;-) I got a DVD burner that supports DVD-RAM (in addition to standard DVD+R/-R). I really liked "use it just like hard disk" properties of DVD-RAM, and according to some sources I found, the media itself is more resistant to ageing than standard DVD+R/-R. Great for archiving my data. But the media seems to be quite expensive. I guess mostly because all the places I found were selling it in most expensive option: as single disc in a nice (and useless) case. Haven't found a single place that sells them on spindle. At the end, I ended up buying a 3-pack, with each media in bulky movie-type case (what a waste of space). Does anybody know of any place that sells DVD-RAM media cheap (in bulk, on spindle)?
DVD-RAM was cheaper (both drive and media) back before DVD-RW and DVD+RW caught on. But that hasn't been the case since about 18-24 months ago when DVD-RW and DVD+RW media dropped under $5. Even if DVD-RAM was even more popular, the media cost would never be as low, large because of its design.
DVD-R(G) compatibility is ultimate and longevity is extremely good in Disc-at-Once (DaO) mode. So if cost is a concern, then you want to use DVD-R(G) with GPL cdrecord+DVDpatch (or free-for-non-commercial cdrecord +ProDVD if that doesn't work) for your backups.
In general, avoid DVD-RW, DVD+RW and DVD+R for backups if you are worried about longevity. Especially DVD-RW and DVD+RW (which _are_ MO- based, despite marketing to the contrary) because of the error rates of MO. DVD-RAM mitigates this with a write-after-verify.
On 8/5/05, Bryan J. Smith b.j.smith@ieee.org wrote:
In general, avoid DVD-RW, DVD+RW and DVD+R for backups if you are worried about longevity. Especially DVD-RW and DVD+RW (which _are_ MO- based, despite marketing to the contrary) because of the error rates of MO. DVD-RAM mitigates this with a write-after-verify.
Can you tell me what does MO-based mean?
MO = "Magneto Optical" http://www.usbyte.com/common/MOsystems.htm
duffmckagan wrote:
On 8/5/05, Bryan J. Smith b.j.smith@ieee.org wrote:
In general, avoid DVD-RW, DVD+RW and DVD+R for backups if you are worried about longevity. Especially DVD-RW and DVD+RW (which _are_ MO- based, despite marketing to the contrary) because of the error rates of MO. DVD-RAM mitigates this with a write-after-verify.
Can you tell me what does MO-based mean?
On 8/5/05, Peter Farrow peter@farrows.org wrote:
MO = "Magneto Optical" http://www.usbyte.com/common/MOsystems.htm
Okay. Thanks.
On Fri, Aug 05, 2005 at 03:11:02PM +0000, duffmckagan wrote:
On 8/5/05, Peter Farrow peter@farrows.org wrote:
MO = "Magneto Optical" http://www.usbyte.com/common/MOsystems.htm
Okay. Thanks.
Hmm - MO needs a magnetic read head... I guess the technology you guys mean is PD as the base for DVD-+RW... Phase Change media (no matter what kind) do have a high error rate... MO media do not. The biggest customer for those is the US government... it is common for a MO disk to have a 40+ year warrenty.
Peter.
On Fri, 2005-08-05 at 14:42 -0400, Peter Arremann wrote:
Hmm - MO needs a magnetic read head... I guess the technology you guys mean is PD as the base for DVD-+RW...
DVD-RW and DVD+RW are Phase Change, not Phase Dual IIRC. DVD-RAM, like PD-CD before it, is a MO variant called Phase Dual.
Phase Change media (no matter what kind) do have a high error rate... MO media do not.
Actually, MO can without write-after-verify correction. But yes, I oversimplified by referring to everything as MO. Sorry about that.
The biggest customer for those is the US government... it is common for a MO disk to have a 40+ year warrenty.
Typical expected lifetime is 30+ years, although that assumes you have other mitigating features (e.g., cartridge).
DVD-RAM is just the DVD Consortium's standard for rewritable. It was introduced early on because it was inexpensive, and created a real standard for optical archiving in a sea of proprietary MO formats.
DVD-RW was more of a consumer answer to DVD+RW.
BTW, from my understanding, DVD+R is more of a WORM implementation of DVD+RW, than a single groove record like CD-R and DVD-R.
Peter Farrow peter@farrows.org wrote:
MO = "Magneto Optical" http://www.usbyte.com/common/MOsystems.htm
MO, as implemented by DVD-RAM, is also called "Phase Dual" sometimes.
Both "Phase Change" and "Phase Dual" have very high error rates at write-time. It is typically 10,000x worse than typical magnetic or WORM (write-once) optical media. I.e., error rates are 10^9, instead of 10^13, meaning you can expect 5 errors for every full DVD.
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Aleksandar Milivojevic -
Bryan J. Smith -
duffmckagan -
Peter Arremann -
Peter Farrow