(a) Mark (mhr) suggested I buy a bare bones box, when I reported the problem with the mainboard in this Dell Dimension 2400 box. Possibly I can have the mainboard repaired (and the PSU, if it is also having problems), and if so, I will give this one to my Stepson and go the bare bones box route and have a more powerful box for myself. I looked at two (2) very low end Desktop mainboards in the store. The one that seems the most interesting is the Biostar P4M890-M7 TE (a Socket LGA 775 board). If possible, I would like to verify that CentOS 5 (32 bit) will work properly, out of the box, or with very simple changes. The Chipset is shown as VIA P4M890/VT8237A. The Graphic chip is shown as Unichrome Pro I GP. The NIC chip shown as Realtek RTL8201CL PHY and the Sound Codec is ALC662. It has two (2) PCI slots and I have NICs and Sound Cards I can install, if the onboard stuff doesn't work on Linux. The Graphic is something that must work, out of the box. Searching on CentOS.org I saw things about Realtek NIC chips, but sounds like they can be made to work. Comments on the probability of this mainboard working OK, or not, are most welcome! I have downloaded the Biostar documentation for this mainboard. This mainboard has support for EIDE, which I need for my HD, DVD-ROM and CD-RW drive. (it has IDE & SATA controllers).
The other mainboard is the MSI P6NGM-L (MS-7366 Ver. 1.0). This one has NVIDIA GeForce7050 / nForce610i. Video is the NVIDIA GeForce 7050. I am not sure if it has support for EIDE. For Storage Devices, they show PATA and SATA. Will either of those support EIDE? I have much less information about this mainboard. Audio chip is Realtek ALC888. LAN chip is Realtek 8201CL.
Both of these mainboards are available locally, and I will not need to order from the states. I am leaning very strongly to the Biostar, and very interested in comments from anyone with experience with these boards, which will be much appreciated.
(b) Planning to use a Celeron 2.0 GHz (Retail) CPU. Will CentOS 5 (32 bit) run on all Celeron's? This Dell Dimension 2400 has a 2.6 GHz Celeron and ran well, until the mainboard problem.....
TIA & Happy New Year to everyone on this wonderful mailing list!
Lanny Marcus wrote:
(a) Mark (mhr) suggested I buy a bare bones box, when I reported the problem with the mainboard in this Dell Dimension 2400 box. ... The one that seems the most interesting is the Biostar P4M890-M7 TE (a Socket LGA 775 board). ...
The other mainboard is the MSI P6NGM-L (MS-7366 Ver. 1.0)....
the PSU in your Dimension 2400 (a celeron system with the i845gv chipset) may not work with a PCI-Express motherboard as they've changed hte PSU spec to require significantly more +12V than in older ATX designs. Also, Dell is fairly notorious for using PSUs that are just barely adequate for the system as originally configured.
if you are going to try to upgrade/replace parts in that system, I'd consider getting a g33 based motherboard (intel dg33tl or equivalent) with a low end core2 chip such as the e2200, along with 2x1GB ddr2 533 or whatever. this would give you a system many times faster than the celeron 2.4ghz of the original, faster but similar onboard video, etc. you may end up needing a new PSU for this, but this combination would work with a very modest pci-express compatible PSU
fwiw, my current main desktop system is a DG33TL mobo + e8500 cpu + 2x2GB ddr2 800mhz, and its a seriously fast and stable system
On Sat, Dec 27, 2008 at 9:53 PM, John R Pierce pierce@hogranch.com wrote:
Lanny Marcus wrote:
(a) Mark (mhr) suggested I buy a bare bones box, when I reported the problem with the mainboard in this Dell Dimension 2400 box. ... The one that seems the most interesting is the Biostar P4M890-M7 TE (a Socket LGA 775 board). ...
The other mainboard is the MSI P6NGM-L (MS-7366 Ver. 1.0)....
the PSU in your Dimension 2400 (a celeron system with the i845gv chipset) may not work with a PCI-Express motherboard as they've changed hte PSU spec to require significantly more +12V than in older ATX designs. Also, Dell is fairly notorious for using PSUs that are just barely adequate for the system as originally configured.
John: Thank you, for your very quick reply! I know you are extremely knowledgeable. Much appreciated. If I buy a new motherboard, it will go into a new case, with a new CPU and 2 GB RAM (max is 4 GB). The PSU in this Dell Dimension 2400 is only 200 or 250 watts, and I suspect that may be part of the problem. Barely adequate, as you wrote. The new case I will buy has a 450 watt PSU as I recall. Something else I hate about this Dell Dimension 2400 box, and at least one other box we have, is there is no Reset switch on the Front Panel. I will get a case that has a Reset switch on it.
if you are going to try to upgrade/replace parts in that system, I'd consider getting a g33 based motherboard (intel dg33tl or equivalent) with a low end core2 chip such as the e2200, along with 2x1GB ddr2 533 or whatever. this would give you a system many times faster than the celeron 2.4ghz of the original, faster but similar onboard video, etc. you may end up needing a new PSU for this, but this combination would work with a very modest pci-express compatible PSU
I will ask about a g33 based motherboard, and a low end Core 2 chip, when I go back to the store, with this Dell Dimension 2400, for the mobo guy to see if he can fix it. He said he can also look at the PSU. I will wait until after New Years Day, to take it in, so they will be open and hopefully very sober....
fwiw, my current main desktop system is a DG33TL mobo + e8500 cpu + 2x2GB ddr2 800mhz, and its a seriously fast and stable system
Thank you again and Happy New Year! Lanny
On Sat, Dec 27, 2008 at 9:53 PM, John R Pierce pierce@hogranch.com wrote: <snip>
designs. Also, Dell is fairly notorious for using PSUs >that are just > barely adequate for the system as >originally configured.
And, I believe, in the Dell Dimensions, we have 4 of them, they use Proprietary cases, motherboards and PSUs. After the quote of about USD$238 for a new motherboard, I think I have lost a lot of enthusiasm for Dell. I'm sure others (HP for example) would charge the same, for Proprietary parts. <snip>
consider getting a g33 based motherboard (intel dg33tl >or equivalent) > with a low end core2 chip such as the >e2200, along with 2x1GB ddr2 533 or whatever. this would give you a system many >times faster than the
When I take this box (hopefully on 5 or 6 January) for the man who repairs motherboards to inspect the motherboard and the PSU, I will ask about the difference in price, for a g33 board and low end Core2 CPU. The Controller of the Currency in our house (my Wife) mentioned to me that we are not in very good shape, after all of the extra Xmas spending..... Your idea sounds excellent, if the $ is there....
Lanny Marcus wrote:
On Sat, Dec 27, 2008 at 9:53 PM, John R Piercepierce@hogranch.com wrote:
<snip> they use Proprietary cases, motherboards and PSUs. After the quote of about USD$238 for a new motherboard, I think I have lost a lot of enthusiasm for Dell. I'm sure others (HP for example) would charge the same, for Proprietary parts. <snip>
not realy, i have an intel mobo in a hp case (the old vectra series) running strong for about 7 years now
consider getting a g33 based motherboard (intel dg33tl>or equivalent)> with a low end core2 chip such as the>e2200, along with 2x1GB ddr2 533 or whatever. this would give you a system many>times faster than the
When I take this box (hopefully on 5 or 6 January) for the man who repairs motherboards to inspect the motherboard and the PSU, I will ask about the difference in price, for a g33 board and low end Core2 CPU. The Controller of the Currency in our house (my Wife) mentioned to me that we are not in very good shape, after all of the extra Xmas spending..... Your idea sounds excellent, if the $ is there....
for low budget look also at the BOXD945GCLF2 depending on where you live it might be hard to get
On Sun, Dec 28, 2008 at 4:06 PM, Tosh toshlinux@gmail.com wrote:
Lanny Marcus wrote:
<snip>
they use Proprietary cases, motherboards and PSUs. >After the quote of about >> USD$238 for a new >motherboard, I think I have lost a lot of enthusiasm for Dell. I'm sure others (HP for example) would >charge the same, for >> Proprietary parts.
<snip>
not realy, i have an intel mobo in a hp case (the old >vectra series) running strong for about 7 years now
On one of our other Dell Dimension boxes, when the PSU died, on the Dell USA Support Forum, I was told they use proprietary cable connectors, between the PSU and MB. I'm assuming that still applies to Dell Dimension boxes, but, maybe not.... Not sure if the case and MB are standard either. Great that your Intel MB is working in your HP case!
consider getting a g33 based motherboard (intel dg33tl>or equivalent)> with a low end core2 chip such as the>e2200, along with 2x1GB ddr2 533 or whatever. this would give you a system many>times faster than the
<snip>
for low budget look also at the BOXD945GCLF2 depending on where you live it might be hard to get
That's our problem. We live in South America and it is better to buy what is available here, than to import from the states and hope it works OK, because there's no warranty if I do that. Will check out the reference you gave me. Thanks!
Lanny Marcus wrote:
And, I believe, in the Dell Dimensions, we have 4 of them, they use Proprietary cases, motherboards and PSUs.
not since the 90s, anyways. at one time, Dell dimensions used PSUs with two wires swapped on the power connector, but they haven't done this in a long long time. Their P4 and newer tower systems should hold any standard ATX board of the right general size (micro vs mini vs full sized, depending on the specific chassis). Dell does like to use passive heatsinks powered by 120mm case fans and shrouds, this obviously won't work if the CPU on the replacement motherboard is in a different place, but the shroud can be removed, the case fan reversed to exhaust, and a conventional heatsink/fan cpu cooler used instead.
On Sun, Dec 28, 2008 at 6:19 PM, John R Pierce pierce@hogranch.com wrote:
Lanny Marcus wrote:
And, I believe, in the Dell Dimensions, we have 4 of them, they use Proprietary cases, motherboards and PSUs.
not since the 90s, anyways. at one time, Dell >dimensions used PSUs with two wires swapped on the power connector, but they >haven't done this in a long long time. Their P4 and newer tower systems >should hold any standard ATX board of the right general size (micro vs >mini vs full sized, depending on the specific chassis). Dell does passive heatsinks powered by 120mm case fans and >shrouds, this obviously won't work if the CPU on the replacement motherboard >is in a different place, but the shroud can be removed, the case fan >reversed to exhaust, and a conventional heatsink/fan cpu cooler used >instead.
John: Everything you wrote was very interesting to me! This box was shipped on 1/6/2005, according to the Dell web site. That may give me some other options. Hoping to take it in (about a 90 minute trip) to the man in Cali on the 5th or 6th of January. He spends his days fixing motherboards. He also can take a look at the PSU, which I suspect may also have issues. The city of Cali celebrates "Feria" (fair) between Xmas and New Years and a lot of places are closed or close at Noon. Thank you and Happy New Year to you and your family! Lanny
On Sat, Dec 27, 2008 at 9:53 PM, John R Pierce pierce@hogranch.com wrote:
Lanny Marcus wrote:
<snip>
the PSU in your Dimension 2400 (a celeron system with the i845gv chipset) may not work with a PCI-Express motherboard as they've changed hte PSU spec to require significantly more +12V than in older ATX designs. Also, Dell is fairly notorious for using PSUs that are just barely adequate for the system as originally configured.
John: Now that the holidays are over, I plan to take the box for the motherboard repairman to look at the motherboard and power supply. Hopefully, Monday or Tuesday.
I did discover that the fan (Exhaust?) for the CPU Shroud is dead. I have suspected a heating problem....
Today, I wanted to put in another hard drive, in case of a disaster when the box is in the shop. I now know why the Dell (Spanish language) manual does not show how to remove a hard drive in the Dimension 2400 series. Took off the bezel, expecting to find 2 or 3 screws holding the HD in place, as in our Compaq Evo and 3 other Dell Dimension boxes. No screws there. They must have some special method of installing hard drives in the factory and/or some special tool. It is going to go to the shop with my hard drive in it, instead of one that has nothing important on it. I did a backup today... I could see two (2) screws. One I could get to. The other one, they must have a special tool in the factory.... And, they never anticipated anyone replacing a hard drive in a Dell Dimension 2400 box? I'm sure it can be done, but not like in our other desktop boxes, where it's a snap.
I won the box in a raffle, which is like a gift from God, so I can't complain, but that's another reason (in addition to the USD$237 cost of a new motherboard delivered to our house) I probably will not buy another Dell.
Hoping he can figure out why the four (4) Diagnostic Lights on the motherboard are Yellow (the Capacitors I can see look OK, if that's a way to judge them...). If nothing else, the damage was probably caused by overheating.....
All of the other symptoms, some of which were major, went away, after I seated all the connectors, RAM, etc. :-)
If the Power Supply needs replacing, hopefully any Generic ATX PSU will be OK. As you wrote, they stopped using Proprietary connectors. That is a big "PLUS". :-)
I saw a Foxconn sticker on the motherboard, which surprised me. I think years ago, Dell put Intel OEM motherboards into Dimension boxes.
Thanks for your help on this! Lanny
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John R Pierce -
Lanny Marcus -
Tosh