[CentOS] wifi on servers and fedora [was Re: 7.2 kernel panic on boot]

Thu Dec 10 15:21:56 UTC 2015
James B. Byrne <byrnejb at harte-lyne.ca>

On Wed, December 9, 2015 16:50, James Hogarth wrote:
> On 9 Dec 2015 9:07 p.m., "Lamar Owen" <lowen at pari.edu> wrote:
>> No, it seems to me that a suitably motivated CentOS user needs to
>> scratch this itch; and, no, I am not volunteering, as I've
>> followed Fedora before......and just simply cannot give the
>> time to it at this point in time in my life.
> <snip>
>> So who wants to be the CentOS-Users to Fedora liaison, likely to be
>> one of the most thankless jobs on the planet?
> I'm an active Fedora packager and yet I dare say Mark would hate me as
> liaison for I find the changes in EL7 most refreshing and look forward
> to bring able to make better use of them in due course ;)
> But I really do question whether someone in this industry is really
> not able to spend 30 minutes or so every six months checking changes
> for anything interesting.
> And frankly if one isn't willing to get either get a subscription and
> feedback as a paying customer or to get involved with the upstream
> sources then no one does not have say in direction and one shouldn't
> be surprised by that.
> If it was a democracy with a vote on every possible choice then we'd
> never get anywhere given the time to carry out such a survey and the
> vast differences in opinions.
> No, as the Debian folks say it is a meritocracy instead and those
> who get stuck in and actively discuss at the right time provide
> the influence on what happens next.

Since the import of what I was trying to convey has been lost,  no
doubt due to my poor choice of words, I will restate the obvious: If
the bulk of the developers working on Fedora use laptops as their
platform then, inevitably, Fedora will become in essence a laptop
distribution and RHEL will follow.  Talking about the server community
monitoring the Fedora development channel once every six months, or
every day for that matter, is simply not going to change this.

A handful of voices representing server installations, who by
definition are not development types, has no hope of dealing with the
incremental changes introduced every day by hundreds of people that
use laptops as their primary development platform and all of whom have
their own 'itch' to scratch.  That is just the way it is in open
source.  The choice to go to Fedora for RHEL development was a
commitment to the laptop environment, whether consciously made or not.
And it is not in the control of RH to dictate this.  If the Fedora
developers take up tablets en masse then guess what?: We will end up
with a tablet distribution.

The OS distro we get is the consequence of the culture and environment
predominant in the development community.  This is neither good nor
bad.  It just is.  Our firm has specific requirements which to date
have been more than adequately met by RHEL and CentOS.  But that seems
to us to be changing in ways that no longer meet our expectations from
a server based distro.

A server based distro to us has certain characteristics that are
orientated to long running processes and system uptimes measured in
months if not years.  I have given up counting how many times I have
to reboot all of our CentOS servers in the past year because of

On the other hand I have this task running on a different server with
a different OS:

   Priority = DS; Inpri = 8; Time = UNLIMITED seconds.
   Job number = #j3719.
   TUE, NOV  4, 2014,  2:04 PM.

We do not need plug-and-play; or usb hot-swapping; or hibernation; or
screen savers; or audio-video players; or power optimisation.  All of
which are worthy things in their own right and certainly have their
place in computing.  While these occasionally have proved convenient
for me none are really necessary for a server host and their presence
undoubtedly significantly increases the complexity and maintenance
burden of the distribution.

What we need is simplicity, stability, reliability, and consistency. 
What seems to be happening instead is feature-creep, software-bloat
and increased coupling.

And lest I be accused of 'wingeing' from the sideline I have been
contributing to Open Source in a modest way since 1995, starting with
Sendmail-8.7 on HP-UX.  I just have limited time to give over to these
things. The selection of RHEL for our primary platform was, in large
part, to reduce the resources given over to managing the software.  It
would be ironic in the extreme were the reverse prove the case.

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