On Thu, Dec 10, 2020 at 8:02 AM Phil Perry <pperry at elrepo.org> wrote: > On 10/12/2020 12:39, Phelps, Matthew wrote: > > > > > > On Thu, Dec 10, 2020 at 7:20 AM Josh Boyer <jwboyer at redhat.com > > <mailto:jwboyer at redhat.com>> wrote: > > > > On Wed, Dec 9, 2020 at 11:40 AM Ljubomir Ljubojevic <centos at plnet.rs > > <mailto:centos at plnet.rs>> wrote: > > > > > > On 12/9/20 4:25 PM, Brendan Conoboy wrote: > > > > On Wed, Dec 9, 2020 at 7:16 AM Phil Perry <pperry at elrepo.org > > <mailto:pperry at elrepo.org> > > > > <mailto:pperry at elrepo.org <mailto:pperry at elrepo.org>>> wrote: > > > > > > > > On 09/12/2020 15:08, Brendan Conoboy wrote: > > > > > On Wed, Dec 9, 2020 at 6:59 AM Ljubomir Ljubojevic > > > > <centos at plnet.rs <mailto:centos at plnet.rs> > > <mailto:centos at plnet.rs <mailto:centos at plnet.rs>> > > > > > <mailto:centos at plnet.rs <mailto:centos at plnet.rs> > > <mailto:centos at plnet.rs <mailto:centos at plnet.rs>>>> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > So when you remove binary compatibility, why would > anyone > > > > bother with > > > > > CentOS/RHEL unless they want a job in a company that > > pays for RHEL > > > > > support? > > > > > > > > > > What sort of binaries are you concerned about being > > incompatible? > > > > > > > > Any kernel device drivers, for a start. Kind of critical if > > your > > > > SAS/RAID device wont boot, or your network device doesn't > > come up, or > > > > your GUI doesn't start because your display drivers aren't > > compatible > > > > anymore. Just minor things like that maybe? > > > > > > > > > > > > OK, so out-of-tree drivers. If those keep on working does that > > make > > > > CentOS Stream viable for your use? > > > > > > The problem we CentOS users have with "RHEL Stream" is "IF" it > > works. I > > > do not want to think about "IF". RHEL Stream is meant to > constantly, > > > daily get packages and patches that are not yet tested, to BE > > tested on > > > > This is actually not the case. Today, our RHEL development model > > requires package updates to undergo testing before they are included > > in the distribution, even internally. CentOS Stream will continue > > this trend as we upstream many of our RHEL CI workflows to Stream > > itself. > > > > > users. From RHEL Stream FAQ: "CentOS Stream is a distribution > that > > > community members can use to take advantage of a stable ABI/API > for > > > development and testing," DEVELOPMENT AND TESTING. > > > > It would be disingenuous to say Stream won't have bugs. All software > > development has bugs. However, the "development and testing" part > > actually extends to the development and testing of the software *you* > > are developing. Stream exists as a base for you to do your own > > development and testing. > > > > > > *WE* aren't doing development and testing! We're running systems that > > are trying to get work done. The whole POINT of CentOS was a recompile > > of the Open Source parts of RHEL. A stable *Enterprise* level operating > > system. > > > > Do you people not understand that?? > > > > Matthew, > > To be fair, this is the CentOS Devel list. Perhaps your comments would > be better placed or more suited to the main CentOS mailing list, but > this list exists specifically to discuss the development of CentOS. If > you are not active in that, or do not want to participate, that's fine > but stick to the users list which would be the correct list for you. > > Thanks > > Fair point, although there has been a lot of cross-posting with centos at centos.org on this thread. > > > > > > I do not have time to mess with "might work, might not" testing > > distro, > > > otherwise I would play on the sand with Fedora. RHEL clone is best > > > available option and in return for me using code prepared for > > RHEL I was > > > telling anyone who would listen how CentOS is great, for me > > better then > > > Debian/Ubuntu or other distro's. CentOS Facebook group has more > > members > > > then Fedora FB group, partially due to me posting ton of resource > > links > > > and how-to's and helping anyone who asked for help even if I had > > to look > > > for answer my self. > > > I do NOT have FAITH that Stream will be production ready, and I > > do not > > > have free time to experiment or check if it will work or not when > > I run > > > update, and that is only thing that matters. No amount of "do not > > worry" > > > will change my mind. As soon as it is crystal clear (I still > > hope) that > > > "CentOS Linux" is dead, I will stop advocating for CentOS, > actually I > > > will start advocating AGAINST CentOS and look for alternatives, > > either > > > other clones or Debian. > > > > > > I will not respond to any more e-mails or tweets about this > > topic, there > > > is nothing more to be said except R.I.P CentOS :-( > > > > I understand if you don't want to continue the conversation. I do > > want to say that with CentOS Stream, we're committed to developing a > > stable and world class project that literally produces RHEL. I hope > > in the future if you decide to revisit your OS choice that you take a > > moment and see what we're doing here. I think you might find that > > we're working very hard to avoid the things you're concerned about, > > because we *need* to avoid those same things in RHEL anyway. > > > > josh > > _______________________________________________ > > CentOS-devel mailing list > > CentOS-devel at centos.org <mailto:CentOS-devel at centos.org> > > https://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos-devel > > <https://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos-devel> > > > > > > > > -- > > > > *Matt Phelps* > > > > *Information Technology Specialist, Systems Administrator* > > > > (Computation Facility, Smithsonian Astrophysical Observatory) > > > > Center for Astrophysics | Harvard & Smithsonian > > > > > > 60 Garden Street | MS 39 | Cambridge, MA 02138 > > > > email: mphelps at cfa.harvard.edu <mailto:mphelps at cfa.harvard.edu> > > > > > > cfa.harvard.edu <http://cfa.harvard.edu/>| Facebook > > <http://cfa.harvard.edu/facebook>| Twitter > > <http://cfa.harvard.edu/twitter>| YouTube > > <http://cfa.harvard.edu/youtube>| Newsletter > > <http://cfa.harvard.edu/newsletter> > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > CentOS-devel mailing list > > CentOS-devel at centos.org > > https://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos-devel > > > > _______________________________________________ > CentOS-devel mailing list > CentOS-devel at centos.org > https://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos-devel > -- *Matt Phelps* *Information Technology Specialist, Systems Administrator* (Computation Facility, Smithsonian Astrophysical Observatory) Center for Astrophysics | Harvard & Smithsonian 60 Garden Street | MS 39 | Cambridge, MA 02138 email: mphelps at cfa.harvard.edu cfa.harvard.edu | Facebook <http://cfa.harvard.edu/facebook> | Twitter <http://cfa.harvard.edu/twitter> | YouTube <http://cfa.harvard.edu/youtube> | Newsletter <http://cfa.harvard.edu/newsletter> -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: <http://lists.centos.org/pipermail/centos-devel/attachments/20201210/2e9d763f/attachment-0005.html>