If someone is willing to help, we need assistance in creating the LiveCD for CentOS 6.0. There is a task in the QAWeb tracker for this here:
http://qaweb.dev.centos.org/qa/node/65
If you are willing/able to help, please reply here or we can discuss in #centos-devel or #centos-social - I'm Jeff_S there.
Thanks, Jeff
On Fri, May 20, 2011 at 9:52 AM, Jeff Sheltren jeff@osuosl.org wrote:
If someone is willing to help, we need assistance in creating the LiveCD for CentOS 6.0. There is a task in the QAWeb tracker for this here:
http://qaweb.dev.centos.org/qa/node/65
If you are willing/able to help, please reply here or we can discuss in #centos-devel or #centos-social - I'm Jeff_S there.
I can/will help. What is needed? I see FabianArrotin posted to the task regarding light gnome desktop+firefox. I can test that, and/or start a parallel LiveMedia with XFCE (or KDE)... My account on QAWeb is not approved, so replies here are better. I'll also hang out in IRC as jamundso.
thanks, jerry
On Mon, May 23, 2011 at 6:23 PM, Jerry Amundson jamundso@gmail.com wrote:
I can/will help. What is needed? I see FabianArrotin posted to the task regarding light gnome desktop+firefox. I can test that, and/or start a parallel LiveMedia with XFCE (or KDE)... My account on QAWeb is not approved, so replies here are better. I'll also hang out in IRC as jamundso.
Jerry, thanks for the help. Your account on QAweb should be activated so feel free to follow up on the ticket directly. Yes, Fabian did some initial work yesterday/today and it's probably best at this point if you can test out his kickstart file(s) and see that they are working OK for you.
Thanks, Jeff
Jeff Sheltren wrote:
Jerry, thanks for the help. Your account on QAweb should be activated so feel free to follow up on the ticket directly. Yes, Fabian did some initial work yesterday/today and it's probably best at this point if you can test out his kickstart file(s) and see that they are working OK for you.
I would strongly suggest adding GParted and other system tools.
5.x LiveCD lacked mdadm. I guess 6.0 kernel has mdadm support, but if it does not make sure you added to CD. Also do not forget about archivers and file managers available, so that LiveCD can be used as repair/recovery tool as well.
Ljubomir
On 05/24/2011 04:45 AM, Jeff Sheltren wrote:
Jerry, thanks for the help. Your account on QAweb should be activated so feel free to follow up on the ticket directly. Yes, Fabian did some initial work yesterday/today and it's probably best at this point if you can test out his kickstart file(s) and see that they are working OK for you.
Jeff, is it worth having sub-tasks for each 'type' of livecd being done ?
- KB
On Tue, May 24, 2011 at 4:14 AM, Karanbir Singh mail-lists@karan.org wrote:
Jeff, is it worth having sub-tasks for each 'type' of livecd being done ?
Yep, good point. Adding those to the issue tracker now.
-Jeff
On 05/24/2011 02:23 AM, Jerry Amundson wrote:
I can/will help. What is needed?
thanks for stepping up.
I see FabianArrotin posted to the task regarding light gnome desktop+firefox. I can test that, and/or start a parallel LiveMedia with XFCE (or KDE)... My account on QAWeb is not approved, so replies here are better. I'll also hang out in IRC as jamundso.
A while back we did a short survey on whats the most popular things that people download as updates from the centos machines and the result basically boiled down to, it would be good to have :
* C6-liveDVD as a desktop environ
* C6-liveCD as a trimmed down desktop, focus on system tools, trim docs and other excess stuff ( I guess, use the c5 livecd script for hints)
* C6-RescueLiveCD with system tools [1]
And have one of those per arch
[1] primary aim for this was that it could be deployed via USB media and/or in a PXE environ, also this does not need a install-from-live-media functionality. Also there might be some scope for this RescueLiveCD to be done away from the distro as a part of the cranberry project ( projects.centos.org ). If we are going to bring in things that are not a part of the core distro - it would certainly need go down that route.
In terms of deliverable: it would be a kickstart and any notes needed to make the build happen. The actual build itself will happen inside the CentOS Buildsys ( and for the first time, in sync with the main distro build! )
- KB
Karanbir Singh wrote:
On 05/24/2011 02:23 AM, Jerry Amundson wrote:
I can/will help. What is needed?
thanks for stepping up.
Ditto that!
<snip>
A while back we did a short survey on whats the most popular things that people download as updates from the centos machines and the result basically boiled down to, it would be good to have :
C6-liveDVD as a desktop environ
C6-liveCD as a trimmed down desktop, focus on system tools, trim docs
and other excess stuff ( I guess, use the c5 livecd script for hints)
- C6-RescueLiveCD with system tools [1]
And have one of those per arch
[1] primary aim for this was that it could be deployed via USB media and/or in a PXE environ, also this does not need a install-from-live-media functionality. Also there might be some scope for this RescueLiveCD to be done away from the distro as a part of the cranberry project ( projects.centos.org ). If we are going to bring in things that are not a part of the core distro - it would certainly need go down that route.
In terms of deliverable: it would be a kickstart and any notes needed to make the build happen. The actual build itself will happen inside the CentOS Buildsys ( and for the first time, in sync with the main distro build! )
A friend has always had a beef with CentOS live CD that it hadn't provided an option for "I like it, now do a real, full installation to the hard drive". I'm not clear as to if your comments covered such. Is this an envisioned use-case? If not, was this usage included in the survey? I could be talked into further research/implementation if this is on target.
Thanks,
On Tue, May 24, 2011 at 7:57 AM, Charles Polisher cpolish@surewest.net wrote:
A friend has always had a beef with CentOS live CD that it hadn't provided an option for "I like it, now do a real, full installation to the hard drive". I'm not clear as to if your comments covered such. Is this an envisioned use-case? If not, was this usage included in the survey? I could be talked into further research/implementation if this is on target.
Yes, both the LiveCD and LiveDVD are planned to support an install to HDD option.
-Jeff
On 05/24/2011 02:23 AM, Jerry Amundson wrote:
I can/will help. What is needed?
C6-liveDVD as a desktop environ
C6-liveCD as a trimmed down desktop, focus on system tools, trim docs
and other excess stuff ( I guess, use the c5 livecd script for hints)
- C6-RescueLiveCD with system tools [1]
And have one of those per arch
Please don't forget that there is an "install to hard drive" functionality now. Trimming the C6-liveCD will result in a CentOS distro with missing stuff compared to a standard installation. Trimming the C6 LiveCD as it was done for C5 is a bad idea.
On 5/24/2011 12:03 PM, Patrice Guay wrote:
On 05/24/2011 02:23 AM, Jerry Amundson wrote:
I can/will help. What is needed?
C6-liveDVD as a desktop environ
C6-liveCD as a trimmed down desktop, focus on system tools, trim docs
and other excess stuff ( I guess, use the c5 livecd script for hints)
- C6-RescueLiveCD with system tools [1]
And have one of those per arch
Please don't forget that there is an "install to hard drive" functionality now. Trimming the C6-liveCD will result in a CentOS distro with missing stuff compared to a standard installation. Trimming the C6 LiveCD as it was done for C5 is a bad idea.
"Missing stuff" is not a big problem if you can get to the point where yum works. I'd love to see an absolutely minimal CD/USB with just the filesystem and raid tools you might need to prepare a disk/raid set and then do an install to the point where the network and yum works. If you are concerned about matching what the DVD install contains you could include scripts with the package lists to pull in later.
On 05/24/2011 10:24 AM, Les Mikesell wrote:
"Missing stuff" is not a big problem if you can get to the point where yum works. I'd love to see an absolutely minimal CD/USB with just the filesystem and raid tools you might need to prepare a disk/raid set and then do an install to the point where the network and yum works. If you are concerned about matching what the DVD install contains you could include scripts with the package lists to pull in later.
Patrice wasn't talking about trimming the CD by selecting a smaller package set, he was talking about trimming the CD by setting up the live CD filesystem and then removing documentation and other "excess stuff". If such a CD were prepared and users installed the content of the live CD to their hard drive, those things would remain missing. Yum wouldn't fix it.
Gordon Messmer wrote on 05/24/2011 01:39 PM:
If such a CD were prepared and users installed the content of the live CD to their hard drive, those things would remain missing. Yum wouldn't fix it.
It would not automatically be fixed by a yum update, but I see no reason yum could not be used to install missing packages. Having a script to use yum to bring in things missing from a default desktop install, as Les suggests, might be a good touch.
Phil
On 05/24/2011 11:10 PM, Phil Schaffner wrote:
Having a script to
use yum to bring in things missing from a default desktop install, as Les suggests, might be a good touch.
Phil _______________________________________________ CentOS-devel mailing list CentOS-devel@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos-devel
I'm not sure it has to be a script. A documented step to be made upon restart by those who used the live cd should be like that:
"Due to space/dependencies limitations some packages were forcibly removed to accommodate the live environment/installer. In order to have a seamless experience regardless for all CentOS instalations, live-cd users are advised/required to perform the following step upon first reboot:
yum install @<group1> @<group2> @<groupX> && yum update"
That should be pretty straightforward to any one.
The exact group of packages to be appended to the above command will be known once the live-dvd packages have been agreed upon.
-- Gabriel Sfestarof
On Tue, May 24, 2011 at 4:05 PM, Gabriel Sfestarof ronin3510@gmail.com wrote:
On 05/24/2011 11:10 PM, Phil Schaffner wrote:
Having a script to
use yum to bring in things missing from a default desktop install, as Les suggests, might be a good touch.
I'm not sure it has to be a script. A documented step to be made upon restart by those who used the live cd should be like that:
"Due to space/dependencies limitations some packages were forcibly removed to accommodate the live environment/installer. In order to have a seamless experience regardless for all CentOS instalations, live-cd users are advised/required to perform the following step upon first reboot:
yum install @<group1> @<group2> @<groupX> && yum update"
Yes, that's safe way around it, I guess. Also, I agree that @group... is needed - "yum reinstall ..." will only act on currently installed packages, and we want *group* matching, correct?
That should be pretty straightforward to any one.
If, by any one, you mean someone minimally familiar with packages and groups of yum-based distros. In other words *not* a shiny new user. Wait, aren't new users a prime target for the LiveCD/DVD concept in the first place??
The exact group of packages to be appended to the above command will be known once the live-dvd packages have been agreed upon.
Yes, all the more reason for the LiveCD to *complete* the install, either right away, or after the reboot. It also becomes virtually the same as both the LiveDVD install *and* installs from other sources, and that seems pretty nice...
jerry
On 05/25/2011 06:32 AM, Jerry Amundson wrote:
On Tue, May 24, 2011 at 4:05 PM, Gabriel Sfestarofronin3510@gmail.com wrote:
On 05/24/2011 11:10 PM, Phil Schaffner wrote:
Having a script to
use yum to bring in things missing from a default desktop install, as Les suggests, might be a good touch.
I'm not sure it has to be a script. A documented step to be made upon restart by those who used the live cd should be like that:
"Due to space/dependencies limitations some packages were forcibly removed to accommodate the live environment/installer. In order to have a seamless experience regardless for all CentOS instalations, live-cd users are advised/required to perform the following step upon first reboot:
yum install @<group1> @<group2> @<groupX> && yum update"
Yes, that's safe way around it, I guess. Also, I agree that @group... is needed - "yum reinstall ..." will only act on currently installed packages, and we want *group* matching, correct?
Well.. it kind of depends on what you want to accomplish: - Assuming I have installed "something" but without the docs, I expect to have the docs/manpages after the reinstall, not to have other packages added. - Assuming I want the rest of the packages from the group[s] which were installed but trimmed, then yes, a groupinstall would be better suited
[...]
The exact group of packages to be appended to the above command will be known once the live-dvd packages have been agreed upon.
Yes, all the more reason for the LiveCD to *complete* the install, either right away, or after the reboot. It also becomes virtually the same as both the LiveDVD install *and* installs from other sources, and that seems pretty nice...
So far each time I wanted a real liveCD experience I used either knoppix or Ubuntu. I would be very angry if after install it would start to download dozens and dozens of MBs just to add to the stuff already existing on the disk. Especially if it would not ask me for permission first.
On 5/25/11 3:22 AM, Manuel Wolfshant wrote:
Yes, all the more reason for the LiveCD to *complete* the install, either right away, or after the reboot. It also becomes virtually the same as both the LiveDVD install *and* installs from other sources, and that seems pretty nice...
So far each time I wanted a real liveCD experience I used either knoppix or Ubuntu. I would be very angry if after install it would start to download dozens and dozens of MBs just to add to the stuff already existing on the disk. Especially if it would not ask me for permission first.
Yes, you can't assume that you have access to the internet at bootup - or that you are allowed to use it even if you do. Publishing the list of packages that are missing or missing components would be fine, or perhaps it could be scripted around an rpm -V to find/fix packages with missing parts - which might be a handy thing in general.
Les Mikesell wrote:
On 5/25/11 3:22 AM, Manuel Wolfshant wrote:
Yes, all the more reason for the LiveCD to *complete* the install, either right away, or after the reboot. It also becomes virtually the same as both the LiveDVD install *and* installs from other sources, and that seems pretty nice...
So far each time I wanted a real liveCD experience I used either knoppix or Ubuntu. I would be very angry if after install it would start to download dozens and dozens of MBs just to add to the stuff already existing on the disk. Especially if it would not ask me for permission first.
Yes, you can't assume that you have access to the internet at bootup - or that you are allowed to use it even if you do. Publishing the list of packages that are missing or missing components would be fine, or perhaps it could be scripted around an rpm -V to find/fix packages with missing parts - which might be a handy thing in general.
There could be set of scripts with links in menu and desktop so you can choose what you want to run, without the need to have it automaticaly. When you first install from CD/DVD, user will have nice icon with nice explanation about the proces and various options.
Ljubomir
On 05/24/2011 08:39 PM, Gordon Messmer wrote:
On 05/24/2011 10:24 AM, Les Mikesell wrote:
"Missing stuff" is not a big problem if you can get to the point where yum works. I'd love to see an absolutely minimal CD/USB with just the filesystem and raid tools you might need to prepare a disk/raid set and then do an install to the point where the network and yum works. If you are concerned about matching what the DVD install contains you could include scripts with the package lists to pull in later.
Patrice wasn't talking about trimming the CD by selecting a smaller package set, he was talking about trimming the CD by setting up the live CD filesystem and then removing documentation and other "excess stuff". If such a CD were prepared and users installed the content of the live CD to their hard drive, those things would remain missing. Yum wouldn't fix it.
yes it would. You can always install the missing bits. hint: yum reinstall
Hi guys,
this is more towards the thread rather than a reply to Wolfy.
On 05/24/2011 09:55 PM, Manuel Wolfshant wrote:
CD to their hard drive, those things would remain missing. Yum wouldn't fix it.
yes it would. You can always install the missing bits. hint: yum reinstall
Is it possible to quantify what this trim actually removes ? Also, we can look at making a %post action of yum reinstall >rpmname< if needed ( but a good first step would be to quantify what this trim actually is )
- KB
On 05/24/2011 07:24 PM, Les Mikesell wrote: <snip>
"Missing stuff" is not a big problem if you can get to the point where yum works. I'd love to see an absolutely minimal CD/USB with just the filesystem and raid tools you might need to prepare a disk/raid set and then do an install to the point where the network and yum works. If you are concerned about matching what the DVD install contains you could include scripts with the package lists to pull in later.
The main idea was to have a basic desktop (for the LiveCD) and a full one (with the LiveDVD). Maybe we can have a very minimal one that will simply install @base + mdadm/lvm tools. Let me build one to see how small it will be. On the other hand, i'd personally not want to see too much requests for custom respins landing in the centos repositories. C6 will probably contains several CD iso images + 2 DVD iso images for the normal distro so adding other ISO image for the live media will add another space constraint on the mirrors serving the ISO images.
So, to recap :
* LiveCD : one basic gnome desktop (+included firefox/totem/gthumb) * LiveDVD : full desktop (with probably both gnome/kde and oo.org) * LiveCDminimum : no desktop but just @core and @base (depending on the available time and the official C6 images)
Fabian
On 5/25/2011 4:06 AM, Karanbir Singh wrote:
On 05/25/2011 08:30 AM, Fabian Arrotin wrote:
- LiveCDminimum : no desktop but just @core and @base (depending on the
available time and the official C6 images)
we dont really need one of these. The netboot iso will mostly satisfy the need for a rescue environment
Is there going to be a single CD server install? If not, a non-GUI liveCD with install capability might fill that need. And again, it doesn't matter what packages are/aren't included because odds are that they will be obsolete when you load them from install media anyway. You just need the parts to get ssh and yum to a usable point after your reboot and the package/group names that a normal install would have included (you may not want them, but you should know how your setup differs).
On 24/05/2011 18:24, "Les Mikesell" lesmikesell@gmail.com wrote:
On 5/24/2011 12:03 PM, Patrice Guay wrote:
On 05/24/2011 02:23 AM, Jerry Amundson wrote:
I can/will help. What is needed?
C6-liveDVD as a desktop environ
C6-liveCD as a trimmed down desktop, focus on system tools, trim docs
and other excess stuff ( I guess, use the c5 livecd script for hints)
- C6-RescueLiveCD with system tools [1]
And have one of those per arch
Please don't forget that there is an "install to hard drive" functionality now. Trimming the C6-liveCD will result in a CentOS distro with missing stuff compared to a standard installation. Trimming the C6 LiveCD as it was done for C5 is a bad idea.
"Missing stuff" is not a big problem if you can get to the point where yum works. I'd love to see an absolutely minimal CD/USB with just the filesystem and raid tools you might need to prepare a disk/raid set and then do an install to the point where the network and yum works.
+1 I would really like to see a bare bones centos live 'spin' too. Then I'll install the rest, either from my own internal repo, or online - that would be awesome
On 05/25/2011 12:15 PM, Mister IT Guru wrote:
On 24/05/2011 18:24, "Les Mikesell"lesmikesell@gmail.com wrote:
On 5/24/2011 12:03 PM, Patrice Guay wrote:
On 05/24/2011 02:23 AM, Jerry Amundson wrote:
I can/will help. What is needed?
C6-liveDVD as a desktop environ
C6-liveCD as a trimmed down desktop, focus on system tools, trim docs
and other excess stuff ( I guess, use the c5 livecd script for hints)
- C6-RescueLiveCD with system tools [1]
And have one of those per arch
Please don't forget that there is an "install to hard drive" functionality now. Trimming the C6-liveCD will result in a CentOS distro with missing stuff compared to a standard installation. Trimming the C6 LiveCD as it was done for C5 is a bad idea.
"Missing stuff" is not a big problem if you can get to the point where yum works. I'd love to see an absolutely minimal CD/USB with just the filesystem and raid tools you might need to prepare a disk/raid set and then do an install to the point where the network and yum works.
+1 I would really like to see a bare bones centos live 'spin' too. Then I'll install the rest, either from my own internal repo, or online - that would be awesome
the netinstall iso was aimed for this purposes ever since it exists. I do not see the point of another iso in this context.
On 5/25/11 4:59 AM, Manuel Wolfshant wrote:
"Missing stuff" is not a big problem if you can get to the point where
yum works. I'd love to see an absolutely minimal CD/USB with just the filesystem and raid tools you might need to prepare a disk/raid set and then do an install to the point where the network and yum works.
+1 I would really like to see a bare bones centos live 'spin' too. Then I'll install the rest, either from my own internal repo, or online - that would be awesome
the netinstall iso was aimed for this purposes ever since it exists. I do not see the point of another iso in this context.
I've had situations where for various reasons it would have been better to get a machine with no dvd drive running without needing network access, then after the reboot do some more setup (mounting drives, add NICs and or drivers, etc.) before completing the install. Or sometimes I've had to use ssh port forwarding to reach a proxy so yum could get to the repositories. Or sometimes you want someone else to do an initial step to get a remote machine to a point where you can ssh in to complete the install (which might involve the things above) and you want it to be as fast and simple as possible. These things don't really match what the netinstall iso does.
-
Charles Polisher -
Fabian Arrotin -
Gabriel Sfestarof -
Gordon Messmer -
Jeff Sheltren -
Jerry Amundson -
Karanbir Singh -
Les Mikesell -
Ljubomir Ljubojevic -
Manuel Wolfshant -
Mister IT Guru -
Patrice Guay -
Phil Schaffner