Back when the CentOS 8 Devel repo[1] was originally introduced, the CentOS Stream 8 Devel repo[2] was kept empty. Now that CentOS 8 is going away, and we are expected to develop on CentOS Stream 8, could we please get CentOS Stream 8 Devel populated with the same packages it once had.
I know there is an initiative for all the missing -devel packages to appear somewhere at sometime. But here is my problem. I'm trying to get KDE rebuilt for CentOS Stream 8 due to the updated qt5 that is now in Stream. plasma-nm, a fairly important piece of KDE, requires mobile-broadband-provider-info-devel which is in the Devel repo.
From what I see, the fastest way to get
mobile-broadband-provider-info-devel somewhere that I can consume it on Stream is via the Devel repo. Thus my question.
Can we get CentOS Stream 8 Devel populated with whatever is in the regular Devel repo.
Thanks Troy Dawson
[1] - http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ [2] - http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/
On 15.05.21 06:51, Troy Dawson wrote:
Back when the CentOS 8 Devel repo[1] was originally introduced, the CentOS Stream 8 Devel repo[2] was kept empty. Now that CentOS 8 is going away, and we are expected to develop on CentOS Stream 8, could we please get CentOS Stream 8 Devel populated with the same packages it once had.
I know there is an initiative for all the missing -devel packages to appear somewhere at sometime. But here is my problem. I'm trying to get KDE rebuilt for CentOS Stream 8 due to the updated qt5 that is now in Stream. plasma-nm, a fairly important piece of KDE, requires mobile-broadband-provider-info-devel which is in the Devel repo. From what I see, the fastest way to get mobile-broadband-provider-info-devel somewhere that I can consume it on Stream is via the Devel repo. Thus my question.
Can we get CentOS Stream 8 Devel populated with whatever is in the regular Devel repo.
Thanks Troy Dawson
[1] - http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ [2] - http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/
JFI:
Downloads from koji instance allowed now. https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/
-- Leon
On Sat, May 15, 2021 at 6:47 AM Leon Fauster via CentOS-devel < centos-devel@centos.org> wrote:
On 15.05.21 06:51, Troy Dawson wrote:
Back when the CentOS 8 Devel repo[1] was originally introduced, the CentOS Stream 8 Devel repo[2] was kept empty. Now that CentOS 8 is going away, and we are expected to develop on CentOS Stream 8, could we please get CentOS Stream 8 Devel populated with the same packages it once had.
I know there is an initiative for all the missing -devel packages to appear somewhere at sometime. But here is my problem. I'm trying to get KDE rebuilt for CentOS Stream 8 due to the updated qt5 that is now in Stream. plasma-nm, a fairly important piece of KDE, requires mobile-broadband-provider-info-devel which is in the Devel repo. From what I see, the fastest way to get mobile-broadband-provider-info-devel somewhere that I can consume it on Stream is via the Devel repo. Thus my question.
Can we get CentOS Stream 8 Devel populated with whatever is in the regular Devel repo.
Thanks Troy Dawson
[1] - http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ [2] - http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/
JFI:
Downloads from koji instance allowed now. https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/
True, but that doesn't get them into the EPEL or COPR build environment.
Troy
On 17/05/2021 15:10, Troy Dawson wrote:
On Sat, May 15, 2021 at 6:47 AM Leon Fauster via CentOS-devel <centos-devel@centos.org mailto:centos-devel@centos.org> wrote:
On 15.05.21 06:51, Troy Dawson wrote: > Back when the CentOS 8 Devel repo[1] was originally introduced, the > CentOS Stream 8 Devel repo[2] was kept empty. > Now that CentOS 8 is going away, and we are expected to develop on > CentOS Stream 8, could we please get CentOS Stream 8 Devel populated > with the same packages it once had. > > I know there is an initiative for all the missing -devel packages to > appear somewhere at sometime. But here is my problem. > I'm trying to get KDE rebuilt for CentOS Stream 8 due to the updated qt5 > that is now in Stream. > plasma-nm, a fairly important piece of KDE, requires > mobile-broadband-provider-info-devel which is in the Devel repo. > From what I see, the fastest way to get > mobile-broadband-provider-info-devel somewhere that I can consume it on > Stream is via the Devel repo. > Thus my question. > > Can we get CentOS Stream 8 Devel populated with whatever is in the > regular Devel repo. > > Thanks > Troy Dawson > > [1] - http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/> > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/>> > [2] - http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/> > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/>> > JFI: Downloads from koji instance allowed now. https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/ <https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/>True, but that doesn't get them into the EPEL or COPR build environment.
Troy
Hi Troy,
As you're now part of the CentOS Stream team, when can we expect to see that Devel repo being populated ? that would help for now SIGs building in cbs.centos.org (and we have also again other requests for built but unreleased pkgs in Devel repo, so having a status update on that one would be good too)
On Mon, May 17, 2021 at 6:22 AM Fabian Arrotin arrfab@centos.org wrote:
On 17/05/2021 15:10, Troy Dawson wrote:
On Sat, May 15, 2021 at 6:47 AM Leon Fauster via CentOS-devel <centos-devel@centos.org mailto:centos-devel@centos.org> wrote:
On 15.05.21 06:51, Troy Dawson wrote: > Back when the CentOS 8 Devel repo[1] was originally introduced, the > CentOS Stream 8 Devel repo[2] was kept empty. > Now that CentOS 8 is going away, and we are expected to develop on > CentOS Stream 8, could we please get CentOS Stream 8 Develpopulated
> with the same packages it once had. > > I know there is an initiative for all the missing -devel packagesto
> appear somewhere at sometime. But here is my problem. > I'm trying to get KDE rebuilt for CentOS Stream 8 due to the updated qt5 > that is now in Stream. > plasma-nm, a fairly important piece of KDE, requires > mobile-broadband-provider-info-devel which is in the Devel repo. > From what I see, the fastest way to get > mobile-broadband-provider-info-devel somewhere that I can consume it on > Stream is via the Devel repo. > Thus my question. > > Can we get CentOS Stream 8 Devel populated with whatever is in the > regular Devel repo. > > Thanks > Troy Dawson > > [1] - http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/> > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/>> > [2] - http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/> > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/> JFI: Downloads from koji instance allowed now. https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/ <https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/>True, but that doesn't get them into the EPEL or COPR build environment.
Troy
Hi Troy,
As you're now part of the CentOS Stream team, when can we expect to see that Devel repo being populated ? that would help for now SIGs building in cbs.centos.org (and we have also again other requests for built but unreleased pkgs in Devel repo, so having a status update on that one would be good too)
Well played good sir. Unfortunately I only deal with the CentOS Stream 9 stuff, but I will bring it up in the team meeting.
I wrote this email on the centos-devel mailing list, as an EPEL package maintainer, that has a problem. Because my EPEL work is done in my spare time, and it's a legitimate EPEL packager problem. And I'd like the solution to be public, and not behind closed doors.
Troy
On 17/05/2021 14:32, Troy Dawson wrote:
On Mon, May 17, 2021 at 6:22 AM Fabian Arrotin <arrfab@centos.org mailto:arrfab@centos.org> wrote:
On 17/05/2021 15:10, Troy Dawson wrote: > > > On Sat, May 15, 2021 at 6:47 AM Leon Fauster via CentOS-devel > <centos-devel@centos.org <mailto:centos-devel@centos.org> <mailto:centos-devel@centos.org <mailto:centos-devel@centos.org>>> wrote: > > On 15.05.21 06:51, Troy Dawson wrote: > > Back when the CentOS 8 Devel repo[1] was originally introduced, the > > CentOS Stream 8 Devel repo[2] was kept empty. > > Now that CentOS 8 is going away, and we are expected to develop on > > CentOS Stream 8, could we please get CentOS Stream 8 Devel populated > > with the same packages it once had. > > > > I know there is an initiative for all the missing -devel packages to > > appear somewhere at sometime. But here is my problem. > > I'm trying to get KDE rebuilt for CentOS Stream 8 due to the > updated qt5 > > that is now in Stream. > > plasma-nm, a fairly important piece of KDE, requires > > mobile-broadband-provider-info-devel which is in the Devel repo. > > From what I see, the fastest way to get > > mobile-broadband-provider-info-devel somewhere that I can consume > it on > > Stream is via the Devel repo. > > Thus my question. > > > > Can we get CentOS Stream 8 Devel populated with whatever is in the > > regular Devel repo. > > > > Thanks > > Troy Dawson > > > > [1] - http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/> > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/>> > > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/> > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/>>> > > [2] - > http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/> > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/>> > > > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/> > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/>>> > > > > JFI: > > Downloads from koji instance allowed now. > https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/ <https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/> > <https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/ <https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/>> > > > True, but that doesn't get them into the EPEL or COPR build environment. > > Troy > Hi Troy, As you're now part of the CentOS Stream team, when can we expect to see that Devel repo being populated ? that would help for now SIGs building in cbs.centos.org <http://cbs.centos.org> (and we have also again other requests for built but unreleased pkgs in Devel repo, so having a status update on that one would be good too)Well played good sir. Unfortunately I only deal with the CentOS Stream 9 stuff, but I will bring it up in the team meeting.
I wrote this email on the centos-devel mailing list, as an EPEL package maintainer, that has a problem. Because my EPEL work is done in my spare time, and it's a legitimate EPEL packager problem. And I'd like the solution to be public, and not behind closed doors.
Troy
I'm not sure I understand why this is even an issue anymore. Now CentOS Stream is upstream of RHEL, surely there are no constraints to only ship what RHEL (downstream) ships? Why wouldn't CentOS Stream simply ship everything and if RHEL decides upon a policy to only ship/support a certain subset of (-devel) packages, that is a RH/RHEL decision that can be implemented downstream by removing the bits they don't want to ship/support and should have zero impact upstream? RH/RHEL are free to do whatever they want downstream.
Or have I completely misunderstood the relationship here?
On Mon, May 17, 2021 at 10:41 AM Phil Perry pperry@elrepo.org wrote:
On 17/05/2021 14:32, Troy Dawson wrote:
On Mon, May 17, 2021 at 6:22 AM Fabian Arrotin <arrfab@centos.org mailto:arrfab@centos.org> wrote:
On 17/05/2021 15:10, Troy Dawson wrote: > > > On Sat, May 15, 2021 at 6:47 AM Leon Fauster via CentOS-devel > <centos-devel@centos.org <mailto:centos-devel@centos.org> <mailto:centos-devel@centos.org <mailto:centos-devel@centos.org>>> wrote: > > On 15.05.21 06:51, Troy Dawson wrote: > > Back when the CentOS 8 Devel repo[1] was originally introduced, the > > CentOS Stream 8 Devel repo[2] was kept empty. > > Now that CentOS 8 is going away, and we are expected to develop on > > CentOS Stream 8, could we please get CentOS Stream 8 Devel populated > > with the same packages it once had. > > > > I know there is an initiative for all the missing -devel packages to > > appear somewhere at sometime. But here is my problem. > > I'm trying to get KDE rebuilt for CentOS Stream 8 due to the > updated qt5 > > that is now in Stream. > > plasma-nm, a fairly important piece of KDE, requires > > mobile-broadband-provider-info-devel which is in the Devel repo. > > From what I see, the fastest way to get > > mobile-broadband-provider-info-devel somewhere that I can consume > it on > > Stream is via the Devel repo. > > Thus my question. > > > > Can we get CentOS Stream 8 Devel populated with whatever is in the > > regular Devel repo. > > > > Thanks > > Troy Dawson > > > > [1] - http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/> > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/>> > > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/> > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/>>> > > [2] - > http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/> > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ < http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/%3E%3E
> > > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ < http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/%3E
> <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ < http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/%3E%3E%3E
> > > > JFI: > > Downloads from koji instance allowed now. > https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/ <https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/> > <https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/ <https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/>> > > > True, but that doesn't get them into the EPEL or COPR build environment. > > Troy > Hi Troy, As you're now part of the CentOS Stream team, when can we expect tosee
that Devel repo being populated ? that would help for now SIGsbuilding
in cbs.centos.org <http://cbs.centos.org> (and we have also again other requests for built but unreleased pkgs in Devel repo, so having a status update on that one would be good too)Well played good sir. Unfortunately I only deal with the CentOS Stream 9 stuff, but I will bring it up in the team meeting.
I wrote this email on the centos-devel mailing list, as an EPEL package maintainer, that has a problem. Because my EPEL work is done in my spare time, and it's a legitimate EPEL packager problem. And I'd like the solution to be public, and not behind closed doors.
Troy
I'm not sure I understand why this is even an issue anymore. Now CentOS Stream is upstream of RHEL, surely there are no constraints to only ship what RHEL (downstream) ships? Why wouldn't CentOS Stream simply ship everything and if RHEL decides upon a policy to only ship/support a certain subset of (-devel) packages, that is a RH/RHEL decision that can be implemented downstream by removing the bits they don't want to ship/support and should have zero impact upstream? RH/RHEL are free to do whatever they want downstream.
Or have I completely misunderstood the relationship here?
Actually, you understood it correctly.
It seems an email got misplaced. When it was announced that CentOS Stream 9 koji build system, including the buildroot, was now publically available, there was also supposed to be a similar announcement concerning CentOS Stream 8. For some reason, that announcement failed to get sent.
So, you are correct, there currently is a way for the EPEL community (or COPR, or whoever wants) to get access to the CentOS Stream 8 build system and complete buildroot. I simply was not aware of it.
I will bring this up with the EPEL community, especially those setting up epel-next.
Sorry for all the noise. But ... now we (I) know.
Troy
On 17/05/2021 18:49, Troy Dawson wrote:
On Mon, May 17, 2021 at 10:41 AM Phil Perry <pperry@elrepo.org mailto:pperry@elrepo.org> wrote:
On 17/05/2021 14:32, Troy Dawson wrote: > > > On Mon, May 17, 2021 at 6:22 AM Fabian Arrotin <arrfab@centos.org <mailto:arrfab@centos.org> > <mailto:arrfab@centos.org <mailto:arrfab@centos.org>>> wrote: > > On 17/05/2021 15:10, Troy Dawson wrote: > > > > > > On Sat, May 15, 2021 at 6:47 AM Leon Fauster via CentOS-devel > > <centos-devel@centos.org <mailto:centos-devel@centos.org> <mailto:centos-devel@centos.org <mailto:centos-devel@centos.org>> > <mailto:centos-devel@centos.org <mailto:centos-devel@centos.org> <mailto:centos-devel@centos.org <mailto:centos-devel@centos.org>>>> > wrote: > > > > On 15.05.21 06:51, Troy Dawson wrote: > > > Back when the CentOS 8 Devel repo[1] was originally > introduced, the > > > CentOS Stream 8 Devel repo[2] was kept empty. > > > Now that CentOS 8 is going away, and we are expected to > develop on > > > CentOS Stream 8, could we please get CentOS Stream 8 Devel > populated > > > with the same packages it once had. > > > > > > I know there is an initiative for all the missing -devel > packages to > > > appear somewhere at sometime. But here is my problem. > > > I'm trying to get KDE rebuilt for CentOS Stream 8 due to the > > updated qt5 > > > that is now in Stream. > > > plasma-nm, a fairly important piece of KDE, requires > > > mobile-broadband-provider-info-devel which is in the Devel > repo. > > > From what I see, the fastest way to get > > > mobile-broadband-provider-info-devel somewhere that I can > consume > > it on > > > Stream is via the Devel repo. > > > Thus my question. > > > > > > Can we get CentOS Stream 8 Devel populated with whatever is > in the > > > regular Devel repo. > > > > > > Thanks > > > Troy Dawson > > > > > > [1] - > http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/> > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/>> > > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/> > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/>>> > > > > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/> > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/>> > > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/> > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/>>>> > > > [2] - > > > http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/> > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/>> > > > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/> <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/>>> > > > > > > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/> <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/>> > > > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/> <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/>>>> > > > > > > > JFI: > > > > Downloads from koji instance allowed now. > > https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/ <https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/> > <https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/ <https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/>> > > <https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/ <https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/> > <https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/ <https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/>>> > > > > > > True, but that doesn't get them into the EPEL or COPR build > environment. > > > > Troy > > > > Hi Troy, > > As you're now part of the CentOS Stream team, when can we expect to see > that Devel repo being populated ? that would help for now SIGs building > in cbs.centos.org <http://cbs.centos.org> <http://cbs.centos.org <http://cbs.centos.org>> (and we have also again > other requests for built but > unreleased pkgs in Devel repo, so having a status update on that one > would be good too) > > > Well played good sir. > Unfortunately I only deal with the CentOS Stream 9 stuff, but I will > bring it up in the team meeting. > > I wrote this email on the centos-devel mailing list, as an EPEL package > maintainer, that has a problem. Because my EPEL work is done in my > spare time, and it's a legitimate EPEL packager problem. And I'd like > the solution to be public, and not behind closed doors. > > Troy > I'm not sure I understand why this is even an issue anymore. Now CentOS Stream is upstream of RHEL, surely there are no constraints to only ship what RHEL (downstream) ships? Why wouldn't CentOS Stream simply ship everything and if RHEL decides upon a policy to only ship/support a certain subset of (-devel) packages, that is a RH/RHEL decision that can be implemented downstream by removing the bits they don't want to ship/support and should have zero impact upstream? RH/RHEL are free to do whatever they want downstream. Or have I completely misunderstood the relationship here?
Hi Troy,
Actually, you understood it correctly.
It seems an email got misplaced. When it was announced that CentOS Stream 9 koji build system, including the buildroot, was now publically available, there was also supposed to be a similar announcement concerning CentOS Stream 8. For some reason, that announcement failed to get sent.
So, you are correct, there currently is a way for the EPEL community (or COPR, or whoever wants) to get access to the CentOS Stream 8 build system and complete buildroot. I simply was not aware of it.
Except, as you stated earlier in the thread, they are not in the CentOS Stream repos, so it is still not possible to easily pull them into build environments.
I believe your question is valid. Why are these packages being excluded from CenOS Stream in the first place? I understand why they are excluded from CentOS Linux 8, as that is a like for like rebuild of RHEL 8, and what is not in RHEL will not be in CentOS Linux. But CentOS Stream is upstream of RHEL, not downstream, so I do not understand why ANY built devel packages are excluded from the CentOS Stream repos. Why would you not ship everything you build??? RHEL policy decisions should not affect what happens upstream.
I will bring this up with the EPEL community, especially those setting up epel-next.
Sorry for all the noise. But ... now we (I) know.
Troy
On Mon, May 17, 2021 at 1:34 PM Phil Perry pperry@elrepo.org wrote:
On 17/05/2021 18:49, Troy Dawson wrote:
On Mon, May 17, 2021 at 10:41 AM Phil Perry <pperry@elrepo.org mailto:pperry@elrepo.org> wrote:
On 17/05/2021 14:32, Troy Dawson wrote: > > > On Mon, May 17, 2021 at 6:22 AM Fabian Arrotin <arrfab@centos.org <mailto:arrfab@centos.org> > <mailto:arrfab@centos.org <mailto:arrfab@centos.org>>> wrote: > > On 17/05/2021 15:10, Troy Dawson wrote: > > > > > > On Sat, May 15, 2021 at 6:47 AM Leon Fauster viaCentOS-devel
> > <centos-devel@centos.org <mailto:centos-devel@centos.org> <mailto:centos-devel@centos.org <mailto:centos-devel@centos.org>> > <mailto:centos-devel@centos.org <mailto:centos-devel@centos.org> <mailto:centos-devel@centos.org <mailto:centos-devel@centos.org>>>> > wrote: > > > > On 15.05.21 06:51, Troy Dawson wrote: > > > Back when the CentOS 8 Devel repo[1] was originally > introduced, the > > > CentOS Stream 8 Devel repo[2] was kept empty. > > > Now that CentOS 8 is going away, and we are expectedto
> develop on > > > CentOS Stream 8, could we please get CentOS Stream 8 Devel > populated > > > with the same packages it once had. > > > > > > I know there is an initiative for all the missing-devel
> packages to > > > appear somewhere at sometime. But here is myproblem.
> > > I'm trying to get KDE rebuilt for CentOS Stream 8 due to the > > updated qt5 > > > that is now in Stream. > > > plasma-nm, a fairly important piece of KDE, requires > > > mobile-broadband-provider-info-devel which is in the Devel > repo. > > > From what I see, the fastest way to get > > > mobile-broadband-provider-info-devel somewhere that I can > consume > > it on > > > Stream is via the Devel repo. > > > Thus my question. > > > > > > Can we get CentOS Stream 8 Devel populated with whatever is > in the > > > regular Devel repo. > > > > > > Thanks > > > Troy Dawson > > > > > > [1] - > http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/> > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/>> > > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/> > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/>>> > > > > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/> > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/>> > > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/> > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/>>>> > > > [2] - > > > http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/> > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ < http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/%3E%3E
> > > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ < http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/%3E < http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ < http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/%3E%3E%3E
> > > > > > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ < http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/%3E < http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ < http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/%3E%3E
> > > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ < http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/%3E < http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ < http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/%3E%3E%3E%...
> > > > > > > JFI: > > > > Downloads from koji instance allowed now. > > https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/ <https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/> > <https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/ <https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/>> > > <https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/ <https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/> > <https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/ <https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/>>> > > > > > > True, but that doesn't get them into the EPEL or COPR build > environment. > > > > Troy > > > > Hi Troy, > > As you're now part of the CentOS Stream team, when can we expect to see > that Devel repo being populated ? that would help for now SIGs building > in cbs.centos.org <http://cbs.centos.org> <http://cbs.centos.org <http://cbs.centos.org>> (and we have alsoagain
> other requests for built but > unreleased pkgs in Devel repo, so having a status update on that one > would be good too) > > > Well played good sir. > Unfortunately I only deal with the CentOS Stream 9 stuff, but Iwill
> bring it up in the team meeting. > > I wrote this email on the centos-devel mailing list, as an EPEL package > maintainer, that has a problem. Because my EPEL work is done inmy
> spare time, and it's a legitimate EPEL packager problem. And I'd like > the solution to be public, and not behind closed doors. > > Troy > I'm not sure I understand why this is even an issue anymore. NowCentOS
Stream is upstream of RHEL, surely there are no constraints to only ship what RHEL (downstream) ships? Why wouldn't CentOS Stream simply ship everything and if RHEL decides upon a policy to only ship/support a certain subset of (-devel) packages, that is a RH/RHEL decision that can be implemented downstream by removing the bits they don't want to ship/support and should have zero impact upstream? RH/RHEL are freeto
do whatever they want downstream. Or have I completely misunderstood the relationship here?Hi Troy,
Actually, you understood it correctly.
It seems an email got misplaced. When it was announced that CentOS Stream 9 koji build system, including the buildroot, was now publically available, there was also supposed to be a similar announcement concerning CentOS Stream 8. For some reason, that announcement failed to get sent.
So, you are correct, there currently is a way for the EPEL community (or COPR, or whoever wants) to get access to the CentOS Stream 8 build system and complete buildroot. I simply was not aware of it.
Except, as you stated earlier in the thread, they are not in the CentOS Stream repos, so it is still not possible to easily pull them into build environments.
I believe your question is valid. Why are these packages being excluded from CenOS Stream in the first place? I understand why they are excluded from CentOS Linux 8, as that is a like for like rebuild of RHEL 8, and what is not in RHEL will not be in CentOS Linux. But CentOS Stream is upstream of RHEL, not downstream, so I do not understand why ANY built devel packages are excluded from the CentOS Stream repos. Why would you not ship everything you build??? RHEL policy decisions should not affect what happens upstream.
This is mostly because we also don't ship it in RHEL and we don't ship it there because we don't want to be on the hook to support it (even RHEL has a budget and limited resources).
As far as CentOS Stream, the promise is that if it runs in CentOS Stream today it should run in the next version of RHEL. By including content in Stream that we don't include in RHEL, suddenly that promise is broken if someone accidentally uses it assuming it's in RHEL.
I'm not saying there aren't ways to work through these issues, but I wanted to give some ideas as to the thought process that got us here.
-Mike
I will bring this up with the EPEL community, especially those setting up epel-next.
Sorry for all the noise. But ... now we (I) know.
Troy
CentOS-devel mailing list CentOS-devel@centos.org https://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos-devel
On 5/17/21 1:46 PM, Mike McGrath wrote:
On Mon, May 17, 2021 at 1:34 PM Phil Perry <pperry@elrepo.org mailto:pperry@elrepo.org> wrote:
On 17/05/2021 18:49, Troy Dawson wrote: > > > On Mon, May 17, 2021 at 10:41 AM Phil Perry <pperry@elrepo.org <mailto:pperry@elrepo.org> > <mailto:pperry@elrepo.org <mailto:pperry@elrepo.org>>> wrote: > > On 17/05/2021 14:32, Troy Dawson wrote: > > > > > > On Mon, May 17, 2021 at 6:22 AM Fabian Arrotin <arrfab@centos.org <mailto:arrfab@centos.org> > <mailto:arrfab@centos.org <mailto:arrfab@centos.org>> > > <mailto:arrfab@centos.org <mailto:arrfab@centos.org> <mailto:arrfab@centos.org <mailto:arrfab@centos.org>>>> wrote: > > > > On 17/05/2021 15:10, Troy Dawson wrote: > > > > > > > > > On Sat, May 15, 2021 at 6:47 AM Leon Fauster via CentOS-devel > > > <centos-devel@centos.org <mailto:centos-devel@centos.org> <mailto:centos-devel@centos.org <mailto:centos-devel@centos.org>> > <mailto:centos-devel@centos.org <mailto:centos-devel@centos.org> <mailto:centos-devel@centos.org <mailto:centos-devel@centos.org>>> > > <mailto:centos-devel@centos.org <mailto:centos-devel@centos.org> > <mailto:centos-devel@centos.org <mailto:centos-devel@centos.org>> <mailto:centos-devel@centos.org <mailto:centos-devel@centos.org> > <mailto:centos-devel@centos.org <mailto:centos-devel@centos.org>>>>> > > wrote: > > > > > > On 15.05.21 06:51, Troy Dawson wrote: > > > > Back when the CentOS 8 Devel repo[1] was originally > > introduced, the > > > > CentOS Stream 8 Devel repo[2] was kept empty. > > > > Now that CentOS 8 is going away, and we are expected to > > develop on > > > > CentOS Stream 8, could we please get CentOS Stream 8 > Devel > > populated > > > > with the same packages it once had. > > > > > > > > I know there is an initiative for all the missing -devel > > packages to > > > > appear somewhere at sometime. But here is my problem. > > > > I'm trying to get KDE rebuilt for CentOS Stream 8 > due to the > > > updated qt5 > > > > that is now in Stream. > > > > plasma-nm, a fairly important piece of KDE, requires > > > > mobile-broadband-provider-info-devel which is in the > Devel > > repo. > > > > From what I see, the fastest way to get > > > > mobile-broadband-provider-info-devel somewhere that > I can > > consume > > > it on > > > > Stream is via the Devel repo. > > > > Thus my question. > > > > > > > > Can we get CentOS Stream 8 Devel populated with > whatever is > > in the > > > > regular Devel repo. > > > > > > > > Thanks > > > > Troy Dawson > > > > > > > > [1] - > > http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/> > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/>> > > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/> > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/>>> > > > > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/> > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/>> > > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/> > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/>>>> > > > > > > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/> > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/>> > > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/> > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/>>> > > > > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/> > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/>> > > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/> > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/>>>>> > > > > [2] - > > > > > > http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/> > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/>> > > > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/> <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/>>> > > > > > > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/> <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/>> <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/> <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/>>>> > > > > > > > > > > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/> <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/>> <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/> <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/>>> > > > > > > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/> <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/>> <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/> <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > JFI: > > > > > > Downloads from koji instance allowed now. > > > https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/ <https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/> > <https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/ <https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/>> > > <https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/ <https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/> > <https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/ <https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/>>> > > > <https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/ <https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/> > <https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/ <https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/>> > > <https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/ <https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/> > <https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/ <https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/>>>> > > > > > > > > > True, but that doesn't get them into the EPEL or COPR build > > environment. > > > > > > Troy > > > > > > > Hi Troy, > > > > As you're now part of the CentOS Stream team, when can we > expect to see > > that Devel repo being populated ? that would help for now > SIGs building > > in cbs.centos.org <http://cbs.centos.org> <http://cbs.centos.org <http://cbs.centos.org>> > <http://cbs.centos.org <http://cbs.centos.org> <http://cbs.centos.org <http://cbs.centos.org>>> (and we have also again > > other requests for built but > > unreleased pkgs in Devel repo, so having a status update on > that one > > would be good too) > > > > > > Well played good sir. > > Unfortunately I only deal with the CentOS Stream 9 stuff, but I will > > bring it up in the team meeting. > > > > I wrote this email on the centos-devel mailing list, as an EPEL > package > > maintainer, that has a problem. Because my EPEL work is done in my > > spare time, and it's a legitimate EPEL packager problem. And I'd > like > > the solution to be public, and not behind closed doors. > > > > Troy > > > > I'm not sure I understand why this is even an issue anymore. Now CentOS > Stream is upstream of RHEL, surely there are no constraints to only > ship > what RHEL (downstream) ships? Why wouldn't CentOS Stream simply ship > everything and if RHEL decides upon a policy to only ship/support a > certain subset of (-devel) packages, that is a RH/RHEL decision that > can > be implemented downstream by removing the bits they don't want to > ship/support and should have zero impact upstream? RH/RHEL are free to > do whatever they want downstream. > > Or have I completely misunderstood the relationship here? > Hi Troy, > > Actually, you understood it correctly. > > It seems an email got misplaced. When it was announced that CentOS > Stream 9 koji build system, including the buildroot, was now publically > available, there was also supposed to be a similar announcement > concerning CentOS Stream 8. For some reason, that announcement failed > to get sent. > > So, you are correct, there currently is a way for the EPEL community (or > COPR, or whoever wants) to get access to the CentOS Stream 8 build > system and complete buildroot. I simply was not aware of it. > Except, as you stated earlier in the thread, they are not in the CentOS Stream repos, so it is still not possible to easily pull them into build environments. I believe your question is valid. Why are these packages being excluded from CenOS Stream in the first place? I understand why they are excluded from CentOS Linux 8, as that is a like for like rebuild of RHEL 8, and what is not in RHEL will not be in CentOS Linux. But CentOS Stream is upstream of RHEL, not downstream, so I do not understand why ANY built devel packages are excluded from the CentOS Stream repos. Why would you not ship everything you build??? RHEL policy decisions should not affect what happens upstream.This is mostly because we also don't ship it in RHEL and we don't ship it there because we don't want to be on the hook to support it (even RHEL has a budget and limited resources).
As far as CentOS Stream, the promise is that if it runs in CentOS Stream today it should run in the next version of RHEL. By including content in Stream that we don't include in RHEL, suddenly that promise is broken if someone accidentally uses it assuming it's in RHEL.
I'm not saying there aren't ways to work through these issues, but I wanted to give some ideas as to the thought process that got us here.
-Mike
Mike,
That is all well and good .. but it is your guys (EPEL and Red Hat SIGs) that need this Development content to be in CentOS Stream and the CentOS Community Build System to build things. (I can build things as this content is already in my Koji buildroot).
And it is me, this list, and the CentOS Stream group that keep getting asked (by EPEL and the RH SIGs) why this open source stuff can not be in CentOS Linux, CentOS Stream and the CBS.
Surely we can set up a non RHEL released repo that your guys can use to build the things that they want.
Thanks, Johnny Hughes
On 17/05/2021 20:30, Johnny Hughes wrote:
On 5/17/21 1:46 PM, Mike McGrath wrote:
On Mon, May 17, 2021 at 1:34 PM Phil Perry <pperry@elrepo.org mailto:pperry@elrepo.org> wrote:
On 17/05/2021 18:49, Troy Dawson wrote: > > > On Mon, May 17, 2021 at 10:41 AM Phil Perry <pperry@elrepo.org <mailto:pperry@elrepo.org> > <mailto:pperry@elrepo.org <mailto:pperry@elrepo.org>>> wrote: > > On 17/05/2021 14:32, Troy Dawson wrote: > > > > > > On Mon, May 17, 2021 at 6:22 AM Fabian Arrotin <arrfab@centos.org <mailto:arrfab@centos.org> > <mailto:arrfab@centos.org <mailto:arrfab@centos.org>> > > <mailto:arrfab@centos.org <mailto:arrfab@centos.org> <mailto:arrfab@centos.org <mailto:arrfab@centos.org>>>> wrote: > > > > On 17/05/2021 15:10, Troy Dawson wrote: > > > > > > > > > On Sat, May 15, 2021 at 6:47 AM Leon Fauster via CentOS-devel > > > <centos-devel@centos.org <mailto:centos-devel@centos.org> <mailto:centos-devel@centos.org <mailto:centos-devel@centos.org>> > <mailto:centos-devel@centos.org <mailto:centos-devel@centos.org> <mailto:centos-devel@centos.org <mailto:centos-devel@centos.org>>> > > <mailto:centos-devel@centos.org <mailto:centos-devel@centos.org> > <mailto:centos-devel@centos.org <mailto:centos-devel@centos.org>> <mailto:centos-devel@centos.org <mailto:centos-devel@centos.org> > <mailto:centos-devel@centos.org <mailto:centos-devel@centos.org>>>>> > > wrote: > > > > > > On 15.05.21 06:51, Troy Dawson wrote: > > > > Back when the CentOS 8 Devel repo[1] was originally > > introduced, the > > > > CentOS Stream 8 Devel repo[2] was kept empty. > > > > Now that CentOS 8 is going away, and we are expected to > > develop on > > > > CentOS Stream 8, could we please get CentOS Stream 8 > Devel > > populated > > > > with the same packages it once had. > > > > > > > > I know there is an initiative for all the missing -devel > > packages to > > > > appear somewhere at sometime. But here is my problem. > > > > I'm trying to get KDE rebuilt for CentOS Stream 8 > due to the > > > updated qt5 > > > > that is now in Stream. > > > > plasma-nm, a fairly important piece of KDE, requires > > > > mobile-broadband-provider-info-devel which is in the > Devel > > repo. > > > > From what I see, the fastest way to get > > > > mobile-broadband-provider-info-devel somewhere that > I can > > consume > > > it on > > > > Stream is via the Devel repo. > > > > Thus my question. > > > > > > > > Can we get CentOS Stream 8 Devel populated with > whatever is > > in the > > > > regular Devel repo. > > > > > > > > Thanks > > > > Troy Dawson > > > > > > > > [1] - > > http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/> > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/>> > > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/> > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/>>> > > > > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/> > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/>> > > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/> > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/>>>> > > > > > > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/> > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/>> > > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/> > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/>>> > > > > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/> > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/>> > > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/> > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/>>>>> > > > > [2] - > > > > > > http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/> > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/>> > > > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/> <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/>>> > > > > > > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/> <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/>> <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/> <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/>>>> > > > > > > > > > > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/> <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/>> <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/> <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/>>> > > > > > > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/> <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/>> <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/> <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/>>>>> > > > > > > > > > > JFI: > > > > > > Downloads from koji instance allowed now. > > > https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/ <https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/> > <https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/ <https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/>> > > <https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/ <https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/> > <https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/ <https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/>>> > > > <https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/ <https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/> > <https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/ <https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/>> > > <https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/ <https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/> > <https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/ <https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/>>>> > > > > > > > > > True, but that doesn't get them into the EPEL or COPR build > > environment. > > > > > > Troy > > > > > > > Hi Troy, > > > > As you're now part of the CentOS Stream team, when can we > expect to see > > that Devel repo being populated ? that would help for now > SIGs building > > in cbs.centos.org <http://cbs.centos.org> <http://cbs.centos.org <http://cbs.centos.org>> > <http://cbs.centos.org <http://cbs.centos.org> <http://cbs.centos.org <http://cbs.centos.org>>> (and we have also again > > other requests for built but > > unreleased pkgs in Devel repo, so having a status update on > that one > > would be good too) > > > > > > Well played good sir. > > Unfortunately I only deal with the CentOS Stream 9 stuff, but I will > > bring it up in the team meeting. > > > > I wrote this email on the centos-devel mailing list, as an EPEL > package > > maintainer, that has a problem. Because my EPEL work is done in my > > spare time, and it's a legitimate EPEL packager problem. And I'd > like > > the solution to be public, and not behind closed doors. > > > > Troy > > > > I'm not sure I understand why this is even an issue anymore. Now CentOS > Stream is upstream of RHEL, surely there are no constraints to only > ship > what RHEL (downstream) ships? Why wouldn't CentOS Stream simply ship > everything and if RHEL decides upon a policy to only ship/support a > certain subset of (-devel) packages, that is a RH/RHEL decision that > can > be implemented downstream by removing the bits they don't want to > ship/support and should have zero impact upstream? RH/RHEL are free to > do whatever they want downstream. > > Or have I completely misunderstood the relationship here? > Hi Troy, > > Actually, you understood it correctly. > > It seems an email got misplaced. When it was announced that CentOS > Stream 9 koji build system, including the buildroot, was now publically > available, there was also supposed to be a similar announcement > concerning CentOS Stream 8. For some reason, that announcement failed > to get sent. > > So, you are correct, there currently is a way for the EPEL community (or > COPR, or whoever wants) to get access to the CentOS Stream 8 build > system and complete buildroot. I simply was not aware of it. > Except, as you stated earlier in the thread, they are not in the CentOS Stream repos, so it is still not possible to easily pull them into build environments. I believe your question is valid. Why are these packages being excluded from CenOS Stream in the first place? I understand why they are excluded from CentOS Linux 8, as that is a like for like rebuild of RHEL 8, and what is not in RHEL will not be in CentOS Linux. But CentOS Stream is upstream of RHEL, not downstream, so I do not understand why ANY built devel packages are excluded from the CentOS Stream repos. Why would you not ship everything you build??? RHEL policy decisions should not affect what happens upstream.This is mostly because we also don't ship it in RHEL and we don't ship it there because we don't want to be on the hook to support it (even RHEL has a budget and limited resources).
As far as CentOS Stream, the promise is that if it runs in CentOS Stream today it should run in the next version of RHEL. By including content in Stream that we don't include in RHEL, suddenly that promise is broken if someone accidentally uses it assuming it's in RHEL.
I'm not saying there aren't ways to work through these issues, but I wanted to give some ideas as to the thought process that got us here.
-Mike
Mike,
That is all well and good .. but it is your guys (EPEL and Red Hat SIGs) that need this Development content to be in CentOS Stream and the CentOS Community Build System to build things. (I can build things as this content is already in my Koji buildroot).
And it is me, this list, and the CentOS Stream group that keep getting asked (by EPEL and the RH SIGs) why this open source stuff can not be in CentOS Linux, CentOS Stream and the CBS.
Surely we can set up a non RHEL released repo that your guys can use to build the things that they want.
Thanks, Johnny Hughes
But from what Mike just said, EPEL/SIGs should be building against those missing -devel packages on Stream because anything built on Stream must also run on RHEL?
On 17/05/2021 20:46, Phil Perry wrote:
On 17/05/2021 20:30, Johnny Hughes wrote:
On 5/17/21 1:46 PM, Mike McGrath wrote:
On Mon, May 17, 2021 at 1:34 PM Phil Perry <pperry@elrepo.org mailto:pperry@elrepo.org> wrote:
On 17/05/2021 18:49, Troy Dawson wrote: > > > On Mon, May 17, 2021 at 10:41 AM Phil Perry <pperry@elrepo.org mailto:pperry@elrepo.org > <mailto:pperry@elrepo.org mailto:pperry@elrepo.org>> wrote: > > On 17/05/2021 14:32, Troy Dawson wrote: > > > > > > On Mon, May 17, 2021 at 6:22 AM Fabian Arrotin <arrfab@centos.org mailto:arrfab@centos.org > <mailto:arrfab@centos.org mailto:arrfab@centos.org> > > <mailto:arrfab@centos.org mailto:arrfab@centos.org <mailto:arrfab@centos.org mailto:arrfab@centos.org>>> wrote: > > > > On 17/05/2021 15:10, Troy Dawson wrote: > > > > > > > > > On Sat, May 15, 2021 at 6:47 AM Leon Fauster via CentOS-devel > > > <centos-devel@centos.org mailto:centos-devel@centos.org <mailto:centos-devel@centos.org mailto:centos-devel@centos.org> > <mailto:centos-devel@centos.org mailto:centos-devel@centos.org <mailto:centos-devel@centos.org mailto:centos-devel@centos.org>> > > <mailto:centos-devel@centos.org mailto:centos-devel@centos.org > <mailto:centos-devel@centos.org mailto:centos-devel@centos.org> <mailto:centos-devel@centos.org mailto:centos-devel@centos.org > <mailto:centos-devel@centos.org mailto:centos-devel@centos.org>>>> > > wrote: > > > > > > On 15.05.21 06:51, Troy Dawson wrote: > > > > Back when the CentOS 8 Devel repo[1] was originally > > introduced, the > > > > CentOS Stream 8 Devel repo[2] was kept empty. > > > > Now that CentOS 8 is going away, and we are expected to > > develop on > > > > CentOS Stream 8, could we please get CentOS Stream 8 > Devel > > populated > > > > with the same packages it once had. > > > > > > > > I know there is an initiative for all the missing -devel > > packages to > > > > appear somewhere at sometime. But here is my problem. > > > > I'm trying to get KDE rebuilt for CentOS Stream 8 > due to the > > > updated qt5 > > > > that is now in Stream. > > > > plasma-nm, a fairly important piece of KDE, requires > > > > mobile-broadband-provider-info-devel which is in the > Devel > > repo. > > > > From what I see, the fastest way to get > > > > mobile-broadband-provider-info-devel somewhere that > I can > > consume > > > it on > > > > Stream is via the Devel repo. > > > > Thus my question. > > > > > > > > Can we get CentOS Stream 8 Devel populated with > whatever is > > in the > > > > regular Devel repo. > > > > > > > > Thanks > > > > Troy Dawson > > > > > > > > [1] - > > http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/> > > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/>> > > > > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/> > > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/>>> > > > > > > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/> > > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/>> > > > > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/> > > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/>>>> > > > > [2] - > > > > > > http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/
http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ >
<http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/
http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/> > > >
<http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/
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http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/>> > > > > > >
<http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/
http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/
http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/> <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/
http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/
http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/>>> > > > > > > > > > >
<http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/
http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/
http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/> <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/
http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/
http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/>> > > > > > >
<http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/
http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/
http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/> <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/
http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/
http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/>>>> > > > > > > > > > > JFI: > > > > > > Downloads from koji instance allowed now. > > > https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/ https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/ > <https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/ https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/> > > <https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/ https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/ > <https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/ https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/>> > > > <https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/ https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/ > <https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/ https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/> > > <https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/ https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/ > <https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/ https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/>>> > > > > > > > > > True, but that doesn't get them into the EPEL or COPR build > > environment. > > > > > > Troy > > > > > > > Hi Troy, > > > > As you're now part of the CentOS Stream team, when can we > expect to see > > that Devel repo being populated ? that would help for now > SIGs building > > in cbs.centos.org http://cbs.centos.org <http://cbs.centos.org http://cbs.centos.org> > <http://cbs.centos.org http://cbs.centos.org <http://cbs.centos.org http://cbs.centos.org>> (and we have also again > > other requests for built but > > unreleased pkgs in Devel repo, so having a status update on > that one > > would be good too) > > > > > > Well played good sir. > > Unfortunately I only deal with the CentOS Stream 9 stuff, but I will > > bring it up in the team meeting. > > > > I wrote this email on the centos-devel mailing list, as an EPEL > package > > maintainer, that has a problem. Because my EPEL work is done in my > > spare time, and it's a legitimate EPEL packager problem. And I'd > like > > the solution to be public, and not behind closed doors. > > > > Troy > > > > I'm not sure I understand why this is even an issue anymore. Now CentOS > Stream is upstream of RHEL, surely there are no constraints to only > ship > what RHEL (downstream) ships? Why wouldn't CentOS Stream simply ship > everything and if RHEL decides upon a policy to only ship/support a > certain subset of (-devel) packages, that is a RH/RHEL decision that > can > be implemented downstream by removing the bits they don't want to > ship/support and should have zero impact upstream? RH/RHEL are free to > do whatever they want downstream. > > Or have I completely misunderstood the relationship here? >
Hi Troy,
> > Actually, you understood it correctly. > > It seems an email got misplaced. When it was announced that CentOS > Stream 9 koji build system, including the buildroot, was now publically > available, there was also supposed to be a similar announcement > concerning CentOS Stream 8. For some reason, that announcement failed > to get sent. > > So, you are correct, there currently is a way for the EPEL community (or > COPR, or whoever wants) to get access to the CentOS Stream 8 build > system and complete buildroot. I simply was not aware of it. >
Except, as you stated earlier in the thread, they are not in the CentOS Stream repos, so it is still not possible to easily pull them into build environments.
I believe your question is valid. Why are these packages being excluded from CenOS Stream in the first place? I understand why they are excluded from CentOS Linux 8, as that is a like for like rebuild of RHEL 8, and what is not in RHEL will not be in CentOS Linux. But CentOS Stream is upstream of RHEL, not downstream, so I do not understand why ANY built devel packages are excluded from the CentOS Stream repos. Why would you not ship everything you build??? RHEL policy decisions should not affect what happens upstream.
This is mostly because we also don't ship it in RHEL and we don't ship it there because we don't want to be on the hook to support it (even RHEL has a budget and limited resources).
As far as CentOS Stream, the promise is that if it runs in CentOS Stream today it should run in the next version of RHEL. By including content in Stream that we don't include in RHEL, suddenly that promise is broken if someone accidentally uses it assuming it's in RHEL.
I'm not saying there aren't ways to work through these issues, but I wanted to give some ideas as to the thought process that got us here.
-Mike
Mike,
That is all well and good .. but it is your guys (EPEL and Red Hat SIGs) that need this Development content to be in CentOS Stream and the CentOS Community Build System to build things. (I can build things as this content is already in my Koji buildroot).
And it is me, this list, and the CentOS Stream group that keep getting asked (by EPEL and the RH SIGs) why this open source stuff can not be in CentOS Linux, CentOS Stream and the CBS.
Surely we can set up a non RHEL released repo that your guys can use to build the things that they want.
Thanks, Johnny Hughes
But from what Mike just said, EPEL/SIGs should be building against those missing -devel packages on Stream because anything built on Stream must also run on RHEL?
Sorry, typo - EPEL/SIGs should NOT be building against those missing -devel packages...
On Mon, May 17, 2021 at 2:48 PM Phil Perry pperry@elrepo.org wrote:
On 17/05/2021 20:46, Phil Perry wrote:
On 17/05/2021 20:30, Johnny Hughes wrote:
On 5/17/21 1:46 PM, Mike McGrath wrote:
On Mon, May 17, 2021 at 1:34 PM Phil Perry <pperry@elrepo.org mailto:pperry@elrepo.org> wrote:
On 17/05/2021 18:49, Troy Dawson wrote: > > > On Mon, May 17, 2021 at 10:41 AM Phil Perry <pperry@elrepo.org <mailto:pperry@elrepo.org> > <mailto:pperry@elrepo.org <mailto:pperry@elrepo.org>>> wrote: > > On 17/05/2021 14:32, Troy Dawson wrote: > > > > > > On Mon, May 17, 2021 at 6:22 AM Fabian Arrotin <arrfab@centos.org <mailto:arrfab@centos.org> > <mailto:arrfab@centos.org <mailto:arrfab@centos.org>> > > <mailto:arrfab@centos.org <mailto:arrfab@centos.org> <mailto:arrfab@centos.org <mailto:arrfab@centos.org>>>> wrote: > > > > On 17/05/2021 15:10, Troy Dawson wrote: > > > > > > > > > On Sat, May 15, 2021 at 6:47 AM Leon Fauster via CentOS-devel > > > <centos-devel@centos.org <mailto:centos-devel@centos.org> <mailto:centos-devel@centos.org <mailto:centos-devel@centos.org>> > <mailto:centos-devel@centos.org <mailto:centos-devel@centos.org> <mailto:centos-devel@centos.org <mailto:centos-devel@centos.org>>> > > <mailto:centos-devel@centos.org <mailto:centos-devel@centos.org> > <mailto:centos-devel@centos.org <mailto:centos-devel@centos.org>> <mailto:centos-devel@centos.org <mailto:centos-devel@centos.org> > <mailto:centos-devel@centos.org <mailto:centos-devel@centos.org>>>>> > > wrote: > > > > > > On 15.05.21 06:51, Troy Dawson wrote: > > > > Back when the CentOS 8 Devel repo[1] was originally > > introduced, the > > > > CentOS Stream 8 Devel repo[2] was keptempty.
> > > > Now that CentOS 8 is going away, and we are expected to > > develop on > > > > CentOS Stream 8, could we please get CentOS Stream 8 > Devel > > populated > > > > with the same packages it once had. > > > > > > > > I know there is an initiative for all the missing -devel > > packages to > > > > appear somewhere at sometime. But here ismy
problem. > > > > I'm trying to get KDE rebuilt for CentOSStream 8 > due to the > > > updated qt5 > > > > that is now in Stream. > > > > plasma-nm, a fairly important piece of KDE, requires > > > > mobile-broadband-provider-info-devel which
is
in the > Devel > > repo. > > > > From what I see, the fastest way to get > > > > mobile-broadband-provider-info-develsomewhere that > I can > > consume > > > it on > > > > Stream is via the Devel repo. > > > > Thus my question. > > > > > > > > Can we get CentOS Stream 8 Devel populated with > whatever is > > in the > > > > regular Devel repo. > > > > > > > > Thanks > > > > Troy Dawson > > > > > > > > [1] - > > http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ > <
http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/
<http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/>> > > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/> > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/
<http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/>>> > > > ><http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ > <
http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/
<http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/>> > > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/> > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/
<http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/>>>> > > > > > > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/> > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/
<http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/>> > > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/> > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/
<http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/>>> > > > ><http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ > <
http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/
<http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/>> > > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/> > <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/
<http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/>>>>> > > > > [2] - > > > > > >http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/
http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ >
<http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/
http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/> > > >
<http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/
http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <
http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/
http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/>> > > > > > >
<http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/
http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <
http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/
http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/> <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/
http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <
http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/
<http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/
> > > > > > > > > ><http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/
http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <
http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/
http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/> <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/
http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <
http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/
http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/>> > > > > > >
<http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/
http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <
http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/
http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/> <http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/
http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/ <
http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/
<http://mirror.centos.org/centos/8-stream/Devel/x86_64/os/Packages/
> > > > > > > > > > JFI: > > > > > > Downloads from koji instance allowed now. > > > https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/ <https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/> > <https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/ <https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/>> > > <https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/ <https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/> > <https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/ <https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/>>> > > > <https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/ <https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/> > <https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/ <https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/>> > > <https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/ <https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/> > <https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/ <https://koji.mbox.centos.org/pkgs/packages/>>>> > > > > > > > > > True, but that doesn't get them into the EPEL or COPR build > > environment. > > > > > > Troy > > > > > > > Hi Troy, > > > > As you're now part of the CentOS Stream team, whencan we > expect to see > > that Devel repo being populated ? that would help for now > SIGs building > > in cbs.centos.org http://cbs.centos.org <http://cbs.centos.org http://cbs.centos.org> > <http://cbs.centos.org http://cbs.centos.org <http://cbs.centos.org http://cbs.centos.org>> (and we have also again > > other requests for built but > > unreleased pkgs in Devel repo, so having a status update on > that one > > would be good too) > > > > > > Well played good sir. > > Unfortunately I only deal with the CentOS Stream 9 stuff, but I will > > bring it up in the team meeting. > > > > I wrote this email on the centos-devel mailing list, as an EPEL > package > > maintainer, that has a problem. Because my EPEL work is done in my > > spare time, and it's a legitimate EPEL packager problem. And I'd > like > > the solution to be public, and not behind closed doors. > > > > Troy > > > > I'm not sure I understand why this is even an issue anymore. Now CentOS > Stream is upstream of RHEL, surely there are no constraints to only > ship > what RHEL (downstream) ships? Why wouldn't CentOS Stream simply ship > everything and if RHEL decides upon a policy to only ship/support a > certain subset of (-devel) packages, that is a RH/RHEL decision that > can > be implemented downstream by removing the bits they don't want to > ship/support and should have zero impact upstream? RH/RHEL are free to > do whatever they want downstream. > > Or have I completely misunderstood the relationship here? >
Hi Troy, > > Actually, you understood it correctly. > > It seems an email got misplaced. When it was announced thatCentOS > Stream 9 koji build system, including the buildroot, was now publically > available, there was also supposed to be a similar announcement > concerning CentOS Stream 8. For some reason, that announcement failed > to get sent. > > So, you are correct, there currently is a way for the EPEL community (or > COPR, or whoever wants) to get access to the CentOS Stream 8 build > system and complete buildroot. I simply was not aware of it. >
Except, as you stated earlier in the thread, they are not in theCentOS Stream repos, so it is still not possible to easily pull them into build environments.
I believe your question is valid. Why are these packages beingexcluded from CenOS Stream in the first place? I understand why they are excluded from CentOS Linux 8, as that is a like for like rebuild of RHEL 8, and what is not in RHEL will not be in CentOS Linux. But CentOS Stream is upstream of RHEL, not downstream, so I do not understand why ANY built devel packages are excluded from the CentOS Stream repos. Why would you not ship everything you build??? RHEL policy decisions should not affect what happens upstream.
This is mostly because we also don't ship it in RHEL and we don't ship it there because we don't want to be on the hook to support it (even RHEL has a budget and limited resources).
As far as CentOS Stream, the promise is that if it runs in CentOS
Stream
today it should run in the next version of RHEL. By including content in Stream that we don't include in RHEL, suddenly that promise is
broken
if someone accidentally uses it assuming it's in RHEL.
I'm not saying there aren't ways to work through these issues, but I wanted to give some ideas as to the thought process that got us here.
-MikeMike,
That is all well and good .. but it is your guys (EPEL and Red Hat SIGs) that need this Development content to be in CentOS Stream and the CentOS Community Build System to build things. (I can build things as this content is already in my Koji buildroot).
And it is me, this list, and the CentOS Stream group that keep getting asked (by EPEL and the RH SIGs) why this open source stuff can not be in CentOS Linux, CentOS Stream and the CBS.
Surely we can set up a non RHEL released repo that your guys can use to build the things that they want.
Thanks, Johnny Hughes
But from what Mike just said, EPEL/SIGs should be building against those missing -devel packages on Stream because anything built on Stream must also run on RHEL?
Sorry, typo - EPEL/SIGs should NOT be building against those missing -devel packages...
I'm always confused by this because the basis of CRB *was* supposed to be what was required to build EPEL. I'm not sure if EPEL has grown since we started or if we just missed the mark with CRB.
-Mike
CentOS-devel mailing list CentOS-devel@centos.org https://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos-devel
On Mon, May 17, 2021 at 2:48 PM Phil Perry pperry@elrepo.org wrote:
On 17/05/2021 20:46, Phil Perry wrote:
On 17/05/2021 20:30, Johnny Hughes wrote:
On 5/17/21 1:46 PM, Mike McGrath wrote:
Snipping content as we seem to have reached some mailing list limit
This is mostly because we also don't ship it in RHEL and we don't ship it there because we don't want to be on the hook to support it (even RHEL has a budget and limited resources).
As far as CentOS Stream, the promise is that if it runs in CentOS
Stream
today it should run in the next version of RHEL. By including content in Stream that we don't include in RHEL, suddenly that promise is
broken
if someone accidentally uses it assuming it's in RHEL.
I'm not saying there aren't ways to work through these issues, but I wanted to give some ideas as to the thought process that got us here.
-MikeMike,
That is all well and good .. but it is your guys (EPEL and Red Hat SIGs) that need this Development content to be in CentOS Stream and the CentOS Community Build System to build things. (I can build things as this content is already in my Koji buildroot).
And it is me, this list, and the CentOS Stream group that keep getting asked (by EPEL and the RH SIGs) why this open source stuff can not be in CentOS Linux, CentOS Stream and the CBS.
Surely we can set up a non RHEL released repo that your guys can use to build the things that they want.
Thanks, Johnny Hughes
But from what Mike just said, EPEL/SIGs should be building against those missing -devel packages on Stream because anything built on Stream must also run on RHEL?
Sorry, typo - EPEL/SIGs should NOT be building against those missing -devel packages...
I'm always confused by this because the basis of CRB *was* supposed to be what was required to build EPEL. I'm not sure if EPEL has grown since we started or if we just missed the mark with CRB.
-Mike
On Mon, May 17, 2021 at 3:57 PM Mike McGrath mmcgrath@redhat.com wrote:
On Mon, May 17, 2021 at 2:48 PM Phil Perry pperry@elrepo.org wrote:
On 17/05/2021 20:46, Phil Perry wrote:
On 17/05/2021 20:30, Johnny Hughes wrote:
On 5/17/21 1:46 PM, Mike McGrath wrote:
Snipping content as we seem to have reached some mailing list limit
This is mostly because we also don't ship it in RHEL and we don't ship it there because we don't want to be on the hook to support it (even RHEL has a budget and limited resources).
As far as CentOS Stream, the promise is that if it runs in CentOS Stream today it should run in the next version of RHEL. By including content in Stream that we don't include in RHEL, suddenly that promise is broken if someone accidentally uses it assuming it's in RHEL.
I'm not saying there aren't ways to work through these issues, but I wanted to give some ideas as to the thought process that got us here.
-MikeMike,
That is all well and good .. but it is your guys (EPEL and Red Hat SIGs) that need this Development content to be in CentOS Stream and the CentOS Community Build System to build things. (I can build things as this content is already in my Koji buildroot).
And it is me, this list, and the CentOS Stream group that keep getting asked (by EPEL and the RH SIGs) why this open source stuff can not be in CentOS Linux, CentOS Stream and the CBS.
Surely we can set up a non RHEL released repo that your guys can use to build the things that they want.
Thanks, Johnny Hughes
But from what Mike just said, EPEL/SIGs should be building against those missing -devel packages on Stream because anything built on Stream must also run on RHEL?
Sorry, typo - EPEL/SIGs should NOT be building against those missing -devel packages...
I'm always confused by this because the basis of CRB *was* supposed to be what was required to build EPEL. I'm not sure if EPEL has grown since we started or if we just missed the mark with CRB.
Unfortunately, I think it's pretty much the latter. :(
On 17/05/2021 20:58, Neal Gompa wrote:
On Mon, May 17, 2021 at 3:57 PM Mike McGrath mmcgrath@redhat.com wrote:
On Mon, May 17, 2021 at 2:48 PM Phil Perry pperry@elrepo.org wrote:
On 17/05/2021 20:46, Phil Perry wrote:
On 17/05/2021 20:30, Johnny Hughes wrote:
On 5/17/21 1:46 PM, Mike McGrath wrote:
Snipping content as we seem to have reached some mailing list limit
This is mostly because we also don't ship it in RHEL and we don't ship it there because we don't want to be on the hook to support it (even RHEL has a budget and limited resources).
As far as CentOS Stream, the promise is that if it runs in CentOS Stream today it should run in the next version of RHEL. By including content in Stream that we don't include in RHEL, suddenly that promise is broken if someone accidentally uses it assuming it's in RHEL.
I'm not saying there aren't ways to work through these issues, but I wanted to give some ideas as to the thought process that got us here.
-MikeMike,
That is all well and good .. but it is your guys (EPEL and Red Hat SIGs) that need this Development content to be in CentOS Stream and the CentOS Community Build System to build things. (I can build things as this content is already in my Koji buildroot).
And it is me, this list, and the CentOS Stream group that keep getting asked (by EPEL and the RH SIGs) why this open source stuff can not be in CentOS Linux, CentOS Stream and the CBS.
Surely we can set up a non RHEL released repo that your guys can use to build the things that they want.
Thanks, Johnny Hughes
But from what Mike just said, EPEL/SIGs should be building against those missing -devel packages on Stream because anything built on Stream must also run on RHEL?
Sorry, typo - EPEL/SIGs should NOT be building against those missing -devel packages...
I'm always confused by this because the basis of CRB *was* supposed to be what was required to build EPEL. I'm not sure if EPEL has grown since we started or if we just missed the mark with CRB.
Unfortunately, I think it's pretty much the latter. :(
Perhaps this is a policy decision that can be reverted in RHEL 9 as it clearly isn't working very well :-)
On Mon, May 17, 2021 at 12:57 PM Mike McGrath mmcgrath@redhat.com wrote:
On Mon, May 17, 2021 at 2:48 PM Phil Perry pperry@elrepo.org wrote:
On 17/05/2021 20:46, Phil Perry wrote:
On 17/05/2021 20:30, Johnny Hughes wrote:
On 5/17/21 1:46 PM, Mike McGrath wrote:
Snipping content as we seem to have reached some mailing list limit
This is mostly because we also don't ship it in RHEL and we don't ship it there because we don't want to be on the hook to support it (even RHEL has a budget and limited resources).
As far as CentOS Stream, the promise is that if it runs in CentOS
Stream
today it should run in the next version of RHEL. By including content in Stream that we don't include in RHEL, suddenly that promise is
broken
if someone accidentally uses it assuming it's in RHEL.
I'm not saying there aren't ways to work through these issues, but I wanted to give some ideas as to the thought process that got us here.
-MikeMike,
That is all well and good .. but it is your guys (EPEL and Red Hat
SIGs)
that need this Development content to be in CentOS Stream and the
CentOS
Community Build System to build things. (I can build things as this content is already in my Koji buildroot).
And it is me, this list, and the CentOS Stream group that keep getting asked (by EPEL and the RH SIGs) why this open source stuff can not be
in
CentOS Linux, CentOS Stream and the CBS.
Surely we can set up a non RHEL released repo that your guys can use to build the things that they want.
Thanks, Johnny Hughes
But from what Mike just said, EPEL/SIGs should be building against
those
missing -devel packages on Stream because anything built on Stream must also run on RHEL?
Sorry, typo - EPEL/SIGs should NOT be building against those missing -devel packages...
From discussions back when the Devel repo was put in place. EPEL/SIGs can
BUILD against the missing -devel packages, they cannot have any runtime requirements on them.
I'm always confused by this because the basis of CRB *was* supposed to be what was required to build EPEL. I'm not sure if EPEL has grown since we started or if we just missed the mark with CRB.
I gave the original package list of what was required to build EPEL, at the time. And the majority of the packages are in CRB. Some were taken off the list. But that was based off EPEL7, where alot of the packages were 5 years old. And also without the main KDE packages. Alot of the EPEL packages, when they started getting built for EPEL8, had new requirements. And then, even at RHEL8 Beta, when I tried to get some of the missing dependencies into CRB, I was told it was too late.
So ya, as you said, we missed the mark with CRB.
Troy
On Mon, May 17, 2021 at 3:46 PM Phil Perry pperry@elrepo.org wrote:
But from what Mike just said, EPEL/SIGs should _NOT_ be building against those missing -devel packages on Stream because anything built on Stream must also run on RHEL?
It took me a while to get my head around this.
The C8 Stream and C9 Stream _buildroots_ have all the packages, including the -devel packages. (For some definition of all.)
If you have privs to build in koji.stream, or CBS (for C8 Stream and some day C9 Stream) then you can expect your build to find the required -devel rpms in the buildroot.
Most (or hopefully all?) shipping package sets don't need the -devel dependencies at run-time. As long as the base packages corresponding to the -devel dependencies are in C8 or C9 Stream (or in RHEL) somewhere, then you should be fine, right?
Or if they're not in one of the C8 or C9 Stream repos (BaseOS, AppStream, Powertools/CodeReadyBuilder) then maybe you'll be able to tag those packages into your SIG repo?
The only place where this sort of falls apart is how to get/use these -devel dependencies on an external build machine, e.g. I have my C9 Stream vm running on my desktop. My only option is to manually download all the "missing" -devel rpms from koji.stream.centos.org and install them that way. Which is less than optimal! I kinda feel like a solution for this is what is being asked for when people ask for a Devel repo.
Are there any flaws in my understanding?
--
Kaleb
On 17/05/2021 21:10, Kaleb Keithley wrote:
On Mon, May 17, 2021 at 3:46 PM Phil Perry <pperry@elrepo.org mailto:pperry@elrepo.org> wrote:
But from what Mike just said, EPEL/SIGs should _NOT_ be building against those missing -devel packages on Stream because anything built on Stream must also run on RHEL?It took me a while to get my head around this.
The C8 Stream and C9 Stream _buildroots_ have all the packages, including the -devel packages. (For some definition of all.)
If you have privs to build in koji.stream, or CBS (for C8 Stream and some day C9 Stream) then you can expect your build to find the required -devel rpms in the buildroot.
Most (or hopefully all?) shipping package sets don't need the -devel dependencies at run-time. As long as the base packages corresponding to the -devel dependencies are in C8 or C9 Stream (or in RHEL) somewhere, then you should be fine, right?
Absolutely, that's my understanding too, a normal binary should run fine on any system without the -devel package being installed, so long as the -devel package only contains headers etc required for the build and has no runtime requirements (these should be in the main package, not the -devel package).
But Mike stated the reason for CentOS Stream not shipping the missing -devel packages is that what is developed and runs on Stream should also run on the next version of RHEL. Hence this is not a valid reason for not shipping these packages in Stream, as the missing -devel packages should never be required when installing the resulting binaries on the next version of RHEL.
Or if they're not in one of the C8 or C9 Stream repos (BaseOS, AppStream, Powertools/CodeReadyBuilder) then maybe you'll be able to tag those packages into your SIG repo?
The only place where this sort of falls apart is how to get/use these -devel dependencies on an external build machine, e.g. I have my C9 Stream vm running on my desktop. My only option is to manually download all the "missing" -devel rpms from koji.stream.centos.org http://koji.stream.centos.org and install them that way. Which is less than optimal! I kinda feel like a solution for this is what is being asked for when people ask for a Devel repo.
Are there any flaws in my understanding?
That is how I see it too.
On 17/05/2021 22.10, Kaleb Keithley wrote:
On Mon, May 17, 2021 at 3:46 PM Phil Perry <pperry@elrepo.org mailto:pperry@elrepo.org> wrote:
But from what Mike just said, EPEL/SIGs should _NOT_ be building against those missing -devel packages on Stream because anything built on Stream must also run on RHEL?It took me a while to get my head around this.
The C8 Stream and C9 Stream _buildroots_ have all the packages, including the -devel packages. (For some definition of all.)
If you have privs to build in koji.stream, or CBS (for C8 Stream and some day C9 Stream) then you can expect your build to find the required -devel rpms in the buildroot.
Afaik this is not 100% true for CBS according to information previously provided on this list: Packages have to be imported on a case-by-case approach. I.e., see https://pagure.io/centos-infra/issue/316
Most (or hopefully all?) shipping package sets don't need the -devel dependencies at run-time. As long as the base packages corresponding to the -devel dependencies are in C8 or C9 Stream (or in RHEL) somewhere, then you should be fine, right?
Or if they're not in one of the C8 or C9 Stream repos (BaseOS, AppStream, Powertools/CodeReadyBuilder) then maybe you'll be able to tag those packages into your SIG repo?
The only place where this sort of falls apart is how to get/use these -devel dependencies on an external build machine, e.g. I have my C9 Stream vm running on my desktop. My only option is to manually download all the "missing" -devel rpms from koji.stream.centos.org http://koji.stream.centos.org and install them that way. Which is less than optimal! I kinda feel like a solution for this is what is being asked for when people ask for a Devel repo.
Yes, that's what people have been asking for here on this list.
To get back to Johnny Hughes' statement/question here: What prohibits "CentOS Stream" from releasing a non RHEL released repository containing all built (sub-) packages not in baseos/appstream/CRB?
So far the only argument rised against this proposal has been that users might expect Red Hat to provide support for these packages. However I do not see why this should be the case? I.e. one could add it to extras similar to how it is currently done for EPEL and others. So far nobody seriously expected Red Hat to officially support packages provided by EPEL.
Peter
Are there any flaws in my understanding?
--
Kaleb
CentOS-devel mailing list CentOS-devel@centos.org https://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos-devel
On Tue, May 18, 2021 at 5:41 AM Peter Georg < peter.georg@physik.uni-regensburg.de> wrote:
The C8 Stream and C9 Stream _buildroots_ have all the packages, including the -devel packages. (For some definition of all.)
If you have privs to build in koji.stream, or CBS (for C8 Stream and some day C9 Stream) then you can expect your build to find the required -devel rpms in the buildroot.
Afaik this is not 100% true for CBS according to information previously provided on this list: Packages have to be imported on a case-by-case approach. I.e., see https://pagure.io/centos-infra/issue/316
That's unfortunate. I guess I can deduce what's in the CX Stream buildroots from what's in kojihub.stream.centos.org.
Where can I see a list of what's in the CBS buildroot, and/or what's what's in any particular buildtag for CBS? Or is the buildtag irrelevant?
Thanks,
--
Kaleb
On Sat, May 15, 2021, at 12:51 AM, Troy Dawson wrote:
I know there is an initiative for all the missing -devel packages to appear somewhere at sometime.
Is there a link for this?
Can we get CentOS Stream 8 Devel populated with whatever is in the regular Devel repo.
Yeah, I'm trying to stand up upstream CI for rpm-ostree on CentOS 8 where we build stuff inside containers launched from CI (i.e. not in Koji for hopefully obvious reasons) and hit this straightaway. (Also the lack of -source repos but eh, I can just parse spec files from dist-git too)
In the end of course, those of us impacted *can* work around this by setting up a repo mirrored elsewhere that has all the stuff. But it makes sense to share that effort rather than each team reinventing it.
OK and I went to check Stream9, and it looks like the issue persists:
``` $ podman run --rm -ti quay.io/centos/centos:stream9-development # cat /etc/yum.repos.d/development.repo [baseos] name=UNSIGNED CentOS Stream 9 BaseOS baseurl=https://composes.stream.centos.org/development/latest-CentOS-Stream/compose/... gpgcheck=0 enabled=1
[appstream] name=UNSIGNED CentOS Stream 9 AppStream baseurl=https://composes.stream.centos.org/development/latest-CentOS-Stream/compose/... gpgcheck=0 enabled=1
[crb] name=UNSIGNED CentOS Stream 9 CRB baseurl=https://composes.stream.centos.org/development/latest-CentOS-Stream/compose/... gpgcheck=0 enabled=0 # yum -y builddep https://gitlab.com/redhat/centos-stream/rpms/ostree/-/raw/c9s/ostree.spec Last metadata expiration check: 0:01:32 ago on Thu Jun 24 20:54:44 2021. Package dracut-055-1.el9.x86_64 is already installed. No matching package to install: 'gpgme-devel' No matching package to install: 'gtk-doc' No matching package to install: 'pkgconfig(fuse)' No matching package to install: 'pkgconfig(libarchive)' Not all dependencies satisfied Error: Some packages could not be found. [root@83cab7ae4efb /]# ```
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Colin Walters -
Fabian Arrotin -
Johnny Hughes -
Kaleb Keithley -
Leon Fauster -
Mike McGrath -
Neal Gompa -
Peter Georg -
Phil Perry -
Troy Dawson